[00:00:02]
>> I'D LIKE TO CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER.
[Oath of Office]
THE FIRST ITEM OF BUSINESS BEFORE WE ACTUALLY CALL THE MEETING IS TO SWEAR IN OUR NEW COUNCIL MEMBERS.JOHN SWINGLER, PLEASE, COME TO THE FRONT.
DISTINGUISHED GUEST, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, WELCOME TO THE OATH OF OFFICE CEREMONY.
TODAY, WE WILL ADMINISTER THE OATH OF OFFICE TO OUR RECENTLY ELECTED CITY COUNCIL MEMBER, JOHN SWINGLER.
THE OATH IS AN IMPORTANT CEREMONIAL GESTURE, SIGNIFYING THE OFFICIAL START TO A TERM OF PUBLIC SERVICE.
THE OATH IS A PUBLIC PLEDGE THAT THE OFFICIAL UNDERSTANDS THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE POSITION AND WILL WORK TO THEIR BEST ABILITY TO FULFILL THOSE DUTIES.
OATHS HAVE BECOME A STAPLE OF REPRESENTATIVE GOVERNMENT.
OATHS OF FEALTY HAVE BEEN AROUND SINCE RECORDED HISTORY, AND THE OATH OF OFFICE DATE BACK TO AT LEAST THE TIME OF ANCIENT ROME.
OATHS HAVE BEEN A REQUIREMENT FOR PUBLIC OFFICE FROM THE NATION'S INCEPTION.
A UNIQUE ASPECT OF OATHS IN THE UNITED STATES IS THAT THEY ARE NOT TO A MONARCH OR LEADER, BUT ARE TO THE FOUNDING DOCUMENTS, AND ULTIMATELY THE PEOPLE THAT ARE GOVERNED.
THE CONSTITUTION SETS OUT THE PRESIDENTIAL OATH IN FULL AND EXPRESSLY PROVIDES THAT CONGRESS SHALL BE BOUND BY AN OATH OR AFFIRMATION TO SUPPORT THIS CONSTITUTION.
AS THE STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS FORMED, THEY ADOPTED OATH MODELS AFTER THE FEDERAL OATH, AND THE TAKING OF AN OATH HAS BECOME A REQUISITE FOR HOLDING NEARLY EVERY PUBLIC OFFICE.
IN RECOGNITION OF THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THE RESPONSIBILITY BESTOWED ON THOSE WHO SERVE THEIR COMMUNITY, MINNESOTA STATUTE 358.05 REQUIRES THAT ALL LOCAL GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS, UPON ENTERING OFFICE, TAKE THE OATH AS DEFINED IN THE MINNESOTA CONSTITUTION, ARTICLE 5, SECTION 6.
WE WILL NOW ADMINISTER THE OATH.
>> THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES.
>> THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES?
>> THE CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.
>> THE CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.
>> IMPARTIALLY EXECUTE DUTIES OF CITY COUNCIL.
>> IMPARTIALLY EXECUTE THE DUTIES OF CITY COUNCIL.
>> TO THE BEST OF MY JUDGMENT AND ABILITY.
>> TO THE BEST OF MY JUDGMENT AND ABILITY.
>> WELCOME, COUNCIL MEMBER SWINGLER.
>> COUNCIL MEMBER SWINGLER WILL NOW SIGN THE OATH HE'S JUST TAKEN.
AND THEN WE'D LIKE TO INVITE THE FAMILY UP FOR A PHOTO IF THEY'D LIKE.
>> LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, THIS CONCLUDES OUR CEREMONY.
CONGRATULATIONS TO THE NEWEST COUNCIL MEMBER.
THE MAYOR WILL NOW BEGIN THE MEETING.
>> FIRST ITEM OF BUSINESS IS TO DO THE ROLL CALL.
AND WE HAVE EVERYONE HERE, INCLUDING OUR NEWEST MEMBER, JOHN SWINGLER, AGAIN, WELCOME TO THE COUNCIL.
WE WILL START OUR MEETING BY RECITING THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. PLEASE JOIN US.
THANK YOU ALL FOR ATTENDING THE MEETING TONIGHT.
FIRST THING WE WILL DO IS APPROVE THE AGENDA.
I WILL ASK FOR ANY CHANGES TO THE AGENDA.
TONIGHT'S CONSENT AGENDA CURRENTLY HAS SEVEN ITEMS.
[Consent Agenda]
CITY COUNCIL MINUTES, CLAIMS, AND BILLS, RESIGNATION, AND RECRUITMENT OF A PUBLIC WORKS MAINTENANCE WORKER.RENAME THE POLICE ADMINISTRATIVE ASSISTANT TO POLICE ADMINISTRATIVE SUPPORT SPECIALIST, HIRE A SEASONAL EMPLOYEE PROFESSIONAL SERVICE CONTRACT REVIEW SCHEDULE, AND UPCOMING WORK SESSION AND COUNSEL TRAINING SCHEDULE.
IS THERE ANY ITEMS THAT COUNCIL WOULD LIKE TO SEE US MOVE OFF OF THE CONSENT AGENDA FOR DISCUSSION? ANY OTHER ITEMS TO ADD TO THE AGENDA? IF NOT, I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA.
>> MOTION TO APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA AS WRITTEN.
>> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? NOT ALL OF THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
[00:05:04]
>> ALL THOSE OPPOSED, SAME SIGN.
MOTION CARRIES. WE'LL MOVE ON TO PUBLIC COMMENTS.
[Public Comments]
JUST A NOTE ABOUT THIS, IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO ADDRESS THE CITY COUNCIL.COUNCIL WILL NOT ENGAGE IN DISCUSSION OR TAKE ACTION ON ITEMS PRESENTED AT THIS TIME.
HOWEVER, COUNCIL MAY REFER ISSUES TO STAFF FOR FOLLOW-UP OR CONSIDERATION TO FUTURE MEETING.
SPEAKER SHOULD STATE THEIR NAME AND HOME ADDRESS AT THE PODIUM BEFORE SPEAKING.
SPEAKER SHOULD BE MINDFUL OF TIME AND LIMIT THE REMARKS TO THREE MINUTES IF POSSIBLE TO ALLOW SUFFICIENT OPPORTUNITY FOR OTHERS TO SPEAK.
I ENCOURAGE SPEAKERS TO ADDRESS THEIR COMMENTS TO THE MAYOR AND COUNCIL, KEEP THEIR REMARKS RESPECTFUL AND RELEVANT.
CRITICISM OF IDEAS IS PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE, BUT ATTACKS AGAINST INDIVIDUALS ARE NOT TOLERATED.
PLEASE MAKE YOUR STATEMENTS IN A CIVIL MANNER.
SIMILARLY, WE'LL ASK EVERYONE IN THE AUDIENCE TO BE RESPECTFUL OF SPEAKERS AND REFRAIN FROM DISRUPTIVE BEHAVIOR SUCH AS SHOUTING, HECKLING, OR MAKING EXCESSIVE NOISE.
WE ALSO SAY THAT AS EACH ITEM IS PRESENTED IN THE REST OF THE AGENDA TONIGHT, WE WILL ALLOW A PERSON TO COME UP AND PRESENT THAT PARTICULAR ITEM, IF IT'S APPROPRIATE.
BUT WE AREN'T GOING TO BE TAKING PUBLIC COMMENTS.
IF YOU'VE GOT PUBLIC COMMENTS ON THE THINGS THAT ARE IN THE REST OF THE AGENDA.
THIS IS PARKS PROJECTS, MOUNTAIN BIKE MULTI-USE TRAIL, HIRING A PART-TIME FIREFIGHTER, STREET IMPROVEMENT PROJECT, PLANNING.
IF YOU'VE GOT COMMENTS ON THOSE ITEMS, PLEASE USE THIS FORUM TO ADDRESS THOSE COMMENTS ON THOSE ITEMS. WITH THAT, I WOULD INVITE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC TO ADDRESS THE COUNCIL. PLEASE.
>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS MALAN MULVANEY, AND I LIVE AT 141 HACKBERRY HILL.
RIGHT ACROSS FROM A BEAUTIFUL PARK.
WHAT I'D LIKE TO POINT OUT IS WE KNOW HACKBERRY IS AT LEAST 50 YEARS OLD, AND IN TOKI IT WAS OLDER NEIGHBORS ARE PROBABLY OLDER.
IT'S ON ITS THIRD SWING SET IN WHAT ROSIE GLEASON WAS INVOLVED, AND SHE PICKED OUT THE COLORS, ISN'T THAT GREAT? HACKBERRY IS JUST UNDER THREE ACRES.
OUR ONLINE CALENDAR IS EMPTY FOR HACKBERRY.
BUT THAT'S NOT TRUE. THERE'S TWO T-BALL GAMES AT MONDAY THROUGH THURSDAY EVERY WEEK NOW AND PROBABLY UNTIL MID-JUNE AT LEAST.
BEDERWOOD, THAT HAS AN ONLINE CALENDAR.
IT'S FILLED MONDAY THROUGH SATURDAY, SIX EVENINGS VERSUS OUR FOUR.
THEY PARK TOAD IN, SIDEWAYS, WHATEVER ALONG WILLOW, AND THEY COME AROUND THE PARK, AND THEY PARK THERE AS WELL.
THEY EVEN PARK ON THE PERSONAL GRASS OF THE LAWNS.
THE PARKING AT BEDERWOOD, YOU'VE GOT A BEAUTIFUL PARKING LOT.
IT'S STRIPED, BUT WHERE DO THE CARS PARK ON EACH SIDE OF STUBBS BAY ROAD? WITH THAT, IT'S ONE LANE TRAFFIC FOR THE CARS, AND YOU HOPE THAT A FIRE ENGINE CAN MAYBE GET THROUGH.
HACKBERRY WAS FORMED BY THE OPTIMIST CLUB, AND THE SWAMPY LAND, WHERE WE HAVE OUR ISSUE, WAS DONATED.
THE OTHER PART ON TOP OF THE HILL, IF YOU WANT TO CALL IT THAT, WAS ALL PURCHASED BY ORONO.
HACKBERRY HAS THE ONLY T-BALL FIELDS IN ORONO.
A REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE BASEBALL ASSOCIATION SAID, WE USED THE TWO AT HACKBERRY, ONE AT MEDINA AND A CHURCH LAWN, AND HE FELT THAT THEY COULD USE MORE.
WE HAVE A SMALL MULTI-USE FIELD, WHICH IS BETWEEN THE TWO FIELDS.
NOW THEY PLAY TWO FLAG FOOTBALL GAMES EACH EVENING.
SO THERE'S EIGHT TEAMS THAT ROTATE IN AND OUT.
THE SKATING RINK AT THE END OF JUNE AND IN JULY IS USED FOR BACH BALL FOR CHALLENGED ADULTS OR YOUTH, UNDER 25, I BELIEVE IS WHAT THEY ARE.
CURRENTLY, WHAT HACKBERRY HAS, IT FITS THE NEED OF THE UPCOMING ATHLETES AND THE GENERATIONS THAT IN THERE.
PLUS, WE HAVE OPEN AREAS FOR CHAIRS, BLANKETS, AND AT FOOTBALL TIME, THEY LINE THE CHAIRS UP ON TOP BY THE PLAYGROUNDS AND THEY WATCH THE FOOTBALL.
THAT'S REALLY KIND OF NEAT TO SEE.
[00:10:02]
THEY'RE ON THE GRASS, AND WHEN THEY'RE USED, THEY GET SHOVED OVER TO THE BASKETBALL COURT, AND IF THEY'RE NOT THERE, KELLY MOVES THEM SO HE CAN MOW THE LAWN.THE TOILETS THEY'RE DOWN BY WILLOW.
THEY ARE HEAVILY USED DURING THE WEEK BY THE UPS, THE MAIL TRUCK, THE BUS DRIVERS, PEOPLE WHO HAVE LUNCH IN THE SHADE OF ELM STREET, WHEN THEY'RE DONE OR HAVE A MEETING, THEY GO DOWN THERE AND USE THE FACILITIES.
ALSO, WE HAVE HAD TWICE THE MEDICARE HELICOPTER LAND IN OUR FIELD, AND WE ASKED WHY? THEY SAID, YOU'RE ONE OF THE PARKS THAT'S OPEN ENOUGH FOR US TO BE ABLE TO DO THIS.
OTHER PARKS HAVE TOO MANY TREES OR TOO MANY OPTICLES IN THE WAY.
MAINTENANCE ON THE PARK ISN'T VERY HOT, BECAUSE I CALLED IN NOVEMBER TO MOVE HEAVY TREES THAT HAD GONE DOWN BEFORE THE SNOW CAME AND THE SLIDING HILL WENT INTO EFFECT.
I GOT TOLD, WE'LL BE RIGHT THERE.
KELLY HAS MOWED SEVERAL TIMES, AND HE'S MOWED THEM OVER TO SUMMER ON ELM STREET AND SUMMER ON MAPLE, AND THEY'RE STILL SITTING THERE.
I THINK SOMEONE FORGOT THE SPRAYER THIS YEAR BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T SPRAYED.
MY QUESTION IS, WHY ARE YOU SQUEEZING BEDERWOOD FIELDS, WHICH IS EIGHT ACRES AND HAS OPEN SPACE, INTO HACKBERRY, THAT'S GOT ONLY THREE ACRES AND HAS ROADS ON ALL FOUR SIDES? IT DOESN'T APPEAR THAT YOU ARE CURRENTLY LISTENING TO THE PARK NEIGHBORS AND THE BASEBALL COURT BECAUSE YOU WANT TO PUT IN FULL-SIZED FIELDS.
ANOTHER THING IN TALKING TO THE GRANT PEOPLE, THEY WILL ACCEPT AND ISSUE A GRANT FOR T-BALL FIELDS.
THEY SAID THE REQUIREMENT IS THAT IT'S A FIELD OF PLAY, NOT A SIZE OF FIELD, AND T-BALL GOES THAT WAY.
THE OTHER THING, WE KNOW THIS IS AT LEAST 50 YEARS OLD, POSSIBLY OLDER.
THE DRAINAGE IS A BIG PROBLEM, BUT WHEN YOU DON'T DO ANYTHING FOR 50 YEARS, WHAT DO YOU EXPECT? DO YOU HAVE TO REARRANGE THE WHOLE PARK, PUT IN FULL-SIZE FIELD, GIVE US VENUE SIX DAYS A WEEK TO FIX THE DRAINAGE? IT DOESN'T QUITE COMPEL.
HACKBERRY DOES HAVE ITS ISSUES.
PARKING IS ONE. SPEEDING IS ANOTHER.
THE SPEEDING ISN'T JUST ON WILLOW.
IT'S ALSO ON HACKBERRY, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE FOOTBALL PEOPLE ARE THERE AND THEIR TEAMS LOST, AND THEY GOT TO RUN TO ANOTHER FIELD, AND SOMEONE'S COMING FROM ANOTHER FIELD TO GET THEIR KID HERE FOR THE NEXT GAME.
THERE'S NO SPEED BUMPS ON HACKBERRY OR WHAT DO YOU CALL THOSE RATTY TAT NOISES, THEY PUT ON HIGHWAYS.
THERE'S NONE OF THAT TO SLOW HIM DOWN.
IF YOU GO BY THE PARK AT 30 MILES AN HOUR, THAT'S FAST.
I GUESS WHAT I'M LOOKING AT IS, I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR ADDRESSING HACKBERRY BECAUSE IT'S LONG PAST DUE, BUT I HOPE THAT YOU CAN KEEP THE VENUES IN THE SCALE OF THE PROPERTY SIZE AND KEEP WHAT WE HAVE CURRENTLY. THANK YOU.
>> OTHERS? PLEASE FEEL FREE TO STEP UP.
>> HI, MY NAME IS CHRIS CLOVER.
I LIVE ON 4957 BRAND NEW IN MITRITA.
I JUST WANTED TO EXPRESS MY EXCITEMENT FOR YOU GUYS CONSIDERING A MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL IN THE AREA.
I HAVE THREE KIDS THAT HAVE GONE THROUGH THE ORONO SCHOOL SYSTEM.
WHEN WE MOVED INTO THE AREA, MY KIDS, AS THEY GREW UP, THEY WEREN'T IN TEAM SPORTS.
OFTENTIMES, THEY KIND OF FELT A LITTLE LEFT OUT WHEN THEY WERE RECREATING WITH OTHER KIDS.
THEY FOUND THE MOUNTAIN BIKE TEAM AT ORONO HIGH SCHOOL, AND I CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT IT'S DONE FOR THEIR YOUTH AND THEIR FITNESS.
I'M JUST SO EXCITED THAT YOU GUYS ARE CONSIDERING DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS.
ALL THE OTHER SPORTS HAVE FIELDS TO PRACTICE AT, WHICH IS AWESOME, BUT IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO FIND A PLACE FOR THE KIDS TO RIDE A BIKE SAFELY, TO TEACH THEM TO DO THAT.
I COACHED FOR ABOUT IT WAS SEVEN YEARS ON THE BIKE TEAM.
IT'S JUST AMAZING SEEING KIDS FROM, LIKE, FIFTH AND SIXTH GRADE GOING FROM BARELY BEING ABLE TO RIDE A BIKE TO WINNING RACES EVEN ON THE NATIONAL LEVEL, WE'VE GOT KIDS THAT ARE JUST LOOKING AT MAKING CAREERS OUT OF IT.
[00:15:04]
IT'S JUST THIS COMBINATION OF FITNESS AND EXHILARATION AND FUN THAT THESE KIDS CAN BUILD A LIFETIME SPORT.IT'S PRETTY COOL. I'M GETTING OLDER, AND, YOU KNOW, KIDS ARE JUST LIKE HEAD DOWN IN THE PHONES ALL THE TIME AND IT JUST DRIVES ME NUTS THAT, KIDS ARE SITTING ON COUCHES.
I LIVE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD, AND SO MANY KIDS DON'T COME OUTSIDE THEY'RE RIDING BIKES WHEN THEY'RE LITTLE, AND TO GO TO SITTING ON THE COUCH PLAYING VIDEO GAMES ON CELL PHONES.
TO BE ABLE TO GET THEM AND BRIDGE THEM OUT OF THE HOME AND GET THEM INTO THE WORLD AND EXPERIENCE NATURE IS A PRETTY COOL THING.
I THINK THERE MAY BE SOME LIKE, PEOPLE THAT ARE AGAINST ADDING MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS IN THESE NATURAL PLACES, BUT I LOOK TO THOSE PEOPLE AND I'M LIKE, WE HAD SOME PROBLEMS AT BEDERWOOD AND I LOOK IN HERE, LIKE, WHO IS GOING TO PRESERVE THIS BEAUTIFUL FOREST BETTER THAN A COMMUNITY THAT LOVES TO BE AMONGST NATURE.
IF THIS FOREST GOES LIKE, TOUCHED WITHOUT, MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS, WHO'S TO SAY, HEY, WE NEED ANOTHER SOCCER FIELD.
PLOW ON ALL THE TREES, WE'RE GOING TO PUT UP BLEACHERS.
WE'RE GOING TO PUT UP PARKING SPOTS AND PUT UP GRASS FIELDS THAT REQUIRE TONS OF WATER.
THE MOUNTAIN BIKERS LOVE THE TREES.
WE DON'T WANT TO TOUCH THE TREES BECAUSE WHEN YOU TOUCH THEM, IT USUALLY HURTS.
I THINK IT'S A GREAT WAY TO PRESERVE THE LAND AND GET THE KIDS TO EXPERIENCE SOME OF THIS PROPERTY THAT THEY CAN'T SEE OTHERWISE.
I'M JUST EXCITED TO SEE IT ON THE AGENDA, AND I HOPE IT GOES THROUGH.
>> IT'S A COOL THING YOU GUYS ARE DOING.
>> HELLO. MY NAME IS KELLY SELMES.
I'M AT 2915 MINNEHAHA CURV IN WAYZATA, AND I'M HERE TO EXPRESS MY STRONG SUPPORT FOR THE PROPOSED DESIGN PHASE OF THE MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL AROUND THE ORONO ORCHARD AT PUBLIC GOLF COURSE.
AS A FORMER RESIDENT OF ORONO WHO NOW RESIDES IN WAYZATA, WE HAVE MAINTAINED OUR STRONG CONNECTION TO THIS COMMUNITY THROUGH OUR SON'S CONTINUED ENROLLMENT IN ORONO SCHOOLS AND ACTIVITIES SINCE PRESCHOOL.
AS A PARENT OF A 15-YEAR-OLD WHO HAS BEEN AN ACTIVE MEMBER OF OUR LOCAL MOUNTAIN BIKE TEAM FOR THE PAST THREE YEARS, I WITNESSED FIRSTHAND THE TRANSFORMATIVE IMPACT THIS SPORT HAS HAD ON YOUNG PEOPLE.
MOUNTAIN BIKING IS MORE THAN JUST A RECREATIONAL ACTIVITY.
IT'S A LIFELONG SPORT THAT INSTILLS DISCIPLINE, BUILDS CONFIDENCE, AND PROMOTES PHYSICAL FITNESS.
UNLIKE MANY TRADITIONAL TEAM SPORTS THAT ARE LIMITED TO SPECIFIC SEASONS OR REQUIRE EXPENSIVE FACILITIES, MOUNTAIN BIKING OFFERS OUR YOUTH A HEALTHY OUTDOOR ACTIVITY THEY CAN ENJOY THROUGHOUT THE SUMMER AND THE FALL MONTHS, AND CONTINUE PURSUING WELL INTO ADULTHOOD.
OUR CHILDREN NEED MORE OPTIONS BEYOND SCHOOL ORGANIZED SPORTS, PARTICULARLY ACTIVITIES THAT CONNECT THEM WITH MINNESOTA'S BEAUTIFUL NATURAL ENVIRONMENT, WHICH IS THE THEME.
THE PROPOSED TRAIL WOULD PROVIDE A SAFE, STRUCTURED SPACE WHERE YOUNG RIDERS CAN [NOISE] SKILLS WHILE FOSTERING A DEEP APPRECIATION FOR OUTDOOR RECREATION AND ENVIRONMENTAL STEWARDSHIP.
THE TRAIL WOULD ALSO SERVE RESIDENTS OF ALL AGES, CREATING A COMMUNITY ASSET THAT PROMOTES HEALTH AND WELLNESS WHILE PROVIDING A SPACE FOR FAMILIES TO RECREATE TOGETHER.
IN A TIME WHEN SCREEN TIME DOMINATES MANY YOUNG PEOPLE'S LIVES, FACILITIES LIKE THIS TRAIL OFFER AN INVALUABLE ALTERNATIVE THAT KIDS GET OUTSIDE, ACTIVE, AND ENGAGE WITH THEIR COMMUNITY.
I URGE YOU TO SUPPORT THIS PROPOSAL WHICH REPRESENTS AN INVESTMENT IN OUR YOUTH AND OUR COMMUNITY'S LONG TERM VITALITY.
THE BENEFITS OF THIS TRAIL WILL BE FELT GENERATIONS TO COME. THANK YOU.
>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS JEN NOLAN.
I RESIDE AT 311 LANE WOOD LANE PLYMOUTH, 55447.
I'VE BEEN A LIFELONG RESIDENT OF PLYMOUTH AND I'VE BEEN RIDING THE LOOSE LINE TRAIL FOR OVER 25 YEARS, INCLUDING THE DIRT TRAILS ALONGSIDE THE HORSE TRAILS.
I'M ALSO A HIGH SCHOOL MOUNTAIN BIKE COACH FOR ST. LOUIS PARK AND BDB.
I'M KNOWN IN THE COMMUNITY FOR ENCOURAGING YOUNG ATHLETES TO EXPLORE THIS POTENTIAL OF MOUNTAIN BIKE RACING, AND TO HEAR THEIR INSPIRATIONS OF I WANT TO TRY THIS.
NOW, AS I TRY AND COACH THESE YOUNG ATHLETES, AS THEY SEEK TO FIND A PLACE TO PLAY, I HAVE TO SEND THEM DOWN ALL THE WAY TO [INAUDIBLE].
WHY? BECAUSE IT'S THE MOST ACCESSIBLE TRAIL FOR NEW RIDERS TO HAVE A LEVEL LONG LOOP TO BUILD THAT CONFIDENCE.
[00:20:07]
OUT HERE IN THE PLYMOUTH, ORONO, WAYZATA, MEDINA AREA, IT IS KNOWN THAT YOU HAVE TO DRIVE TO ANY TRAILS.KIDS DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO DRIVE.
HOW DO THEY LEARN AND EXPLORE? I'VE SEEN THIS FIRSTHAND WITH MY THREE BOYS, THE STRUGGLE TO TEACH THEM, AS WELL AS THESE NEW EMERGING [INAUDIBLE], ON A TRAIL THAT'S MAINTAINED, ADEQUATE FOR THEIR SKILL LEVEL, AND CURATED FOR THEM TO [INAUDIBLE] IN THE SPORT.
I'VE RIDDEN ON THE TRAILS ALONGSIDE THE LOOSE LINE TO TRY AND EXPLORE THAT AS AN OPTION.
AS MANY OF YOU HAVE WALKED THOSE, THEY'RE RIDDEN BY HORSES.
THEY'RE NOT MAINTAINED. THEY'RE OVERGROWN.
IT'S ERRATIC AND HARD TO PREDICT.
I'LL TAKE A GROUP OUT, AND GUESS WHAT? WE CAN'T RIDE THOSE.
THEN WE'RE STUCK PLANNING AN ALTERNATIVE ROUTE.
I'M HERE TO ASK THIS GREEN LOOP OPTION OPENS DOORS FOR KIDS TO RIDE THE ACCESSIBLE LOOSE LINE SAFE TRAIL THAT PARENTS HAVE CONFIDENCE, THAT THEIR KIDS CAN LEARN TO PRACTICE, RIDE TO EXPLORE ON AN EASIER TRAIL.
MAYBE THEY'LL GO WITH THEM INSTEAD OF DRIVING 25 PLUS MILES TO ENABLE THEIR KIDS TO EXPLORE THE SPORT.
[INAUDIBLE] SUPPORT MOUNTAIN BIKE DREAMS. THANK YOU.
CAN YOU HAVE THE SPEAK INTO THE MICROPHONE? SURE.
LET ME RAISE THAT UP. THERE YOU GO.
HI. MY NAME IS MIKE [INAUDIBLE].
I RESIDE AT 15372 64TH AVENUE NORTH MAPLE GROVE.
I AM THE HEAD COACH FOR THE WAYZATA MOUNTAIN BIKE TEAM.
TO SAY I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL IS OBVIOUSLY, I AM IN FAVOR OF IT.
WE RUN INTO THE SAME ISSUES THAT THE ORONO TEAM HAS.
THE CLOSEST SINGLE TRACK TO US IS BASICALLY LAKE REBECCA, WHICH IS 20 MINUTES AWAY, AND THAT'S A DRIVE.
BECAUSE THE LENGTH OF THIS DRIVE CAN BE DIFFICULT THREE DAYS A WEEK WHEN WE PRACTICE, I HAVE ONE PRACTICE WEEK AT THE GLEASON LAKE ELEMENTARY SCHOOL IN WAYZATA.
IF YOU KNOW THE SCHOOL, IT SITS RIGHT IN THE LOOSE LINE.
WE DO THAT FOR BASICALLY BUILDING CARDIO.
THIS PRACTICE IS THE LEAST ATTENDED PRACTICE THAT I HAVE MY ATHLETES COME TO.
IF YOU ASK THEM WHY, THEY JUST SAY, I DON'T WANT TO RIDE A SINGLE TRACK.
THEY DON'T LIKE THE HILL REPEATS APPARENTLY.
BY HAVING THE TRAIL BUILT, WE WILL WORK WITH THE ORONO TEAM TO MAKE SURE THAT IT IS NOT OVERWHELMED BY THE TWO TEAMS. MINNESOTA CYCLING ASSOCIATION DOES HAVE A TOOL TO MAKE CERTAIN THAT THIS DOESN'T HAPPEN.
THEY CALL IT THE TRAIL CALENDAR, AND WE ALL FILL IT OUT AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR.
THE PROPOSED LOCATION WOULD BE THE PERFECT FOR THE WAYZATA TEAM.
BASICALLY OUT OF GLEASON LAKE, IT SITS ABOUT 3.5 MILES FROM GLEASON LAKE ON THE LOOSE LINE.
MEANS THE TEAM CAN RIDE ON THE LOOSE LINE TO THE TRAIL, GET A COUPLE MILES IN, AND RIDE BACK.
THAT'S ROUGHLY NINE MILES TOTAL.
IT WORKS REALLY GOOD FOR THE LEAST EXPERIENCED GROUPS.
I FEEL LIKE ATTENDANCE TO THESE PRACTICES OBVIOUSLY WOULD INCREASE BECAUSE NOW WE HAVE SOME SINGLE TRACK TO RIDE IN.
THE WAYZATA TEAM IS ALSO COMMITTED TO BASICALLY MAINTAINING THE TRAIL AFTER IT'S BUILT.
WE WILL WORK WITH WHOEVER WE NEED TO TO MAKE CERTAIN THAT IF ANYTHING NEEDS TO HAPPEN, WE WILL BE THERE.
COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, THE WAYZATA TEAM WON THE TRAIL BUILDER ASSOCIATION, BASICALLY THE TRAIL MAINTENANCE, SO WE ARE COMMITTED TO BASICALLY MAINTAINING THE TRAILS WE RIDE ON. THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.
>> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? [LAUGHTER].
>> HELLO, I'M KELLY JEREMIASON, 5580 EASTVIEW AVENUE IN MINNETRISTA.
I'M CURRENTLY THE TEAM DIRECTOR FOR THE ORONO MOUNTAIN BIKING TEAM.
THIS WILL BE MY SIXTH SEASON WITH THE TEAM.
BOTH OF MY KIDS HAVE RIDDEN WITH THE TEAM.
I'VE BEEN AN ORONO TEACHER FOR 27 YEARS.
I'VE SEEN THESE KIDS GO THROUGH.
WHEN I FIRST SAW THE PLANS FOR THIS TRAIL, IT JUST MADE SO MUCH SENSE.
[00:25:03]
I'M AN AVID GOLFER AS WELL.I'VE WALKED THROUGH THOSE TREES.
DIDN'T SAY I WAS A GOOD GOLFER.
I JUST THOUGHT, WE PRACTICE BEDERWOOD ONCE EVERY OTHER WEEK, AND THEN WE HAVE TO TRAVEL OUT TO EITHER LAKE REBECCA OR TO MONARCH.
WHEN WE DO THE BEDERWOOD PRACTICES, IT'S THE SAME AS WAS MENTIONED BEFORE, THAT'S THE LOWER TURNOUT.
THAT'S WHERE WE DO OUR SKILLS WORK.
THAT'S WHERE WE TEACH THE KIDS HOW TO HANDLE THE TRAILS AND TO BE ABLE TO DO A LITTLE BIT OF SKILLS WORK AND THEN ACTUALLY GET ON SOME SINGLE TRACK AND PUT IT TO PRACTICE, AND THEN COME BACK AND TALK IT THROUGH, WOULD JUST BE AN AMAZING THING.
I JUST THINK THAT THIS WOULD BE AN AWESOME OPPORTUNITY FOR RIDERS AND FOR THE PUBLIC ALL AROUND.
I HOPE YOU SUPPORT IT. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. NOW IT'S YOUR TURN.
>> I PROBABLY [INAUDIBLE] THE MIC, BUT IF IT'S NOT CLEAR, JUST LET ME KNOW.
YEAH, IT'S PRETTY CLEAR. I CAN HEAR IT, TOO.
I LIVE AT, I HAVE TO REMEMBER NOW, 1105 QUIN WOOD LANE NORTH, PLYMOUTH, MINNESOTA.
I GREW UP IN THIS AREA, AND I'VE SPENT MOST OF MY LIFE HERE.
I HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO ALSO MOUNTAIN BIKE IN TIME EXPERIENCED OUT IN COLORADO AS WELL.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT MINNESOTA IS THE AMOUNT OF MOUNTAIN BIKING THAT'S AVAILABLE HERE, IT'S ON PAR.
I LIVED IN A SKI TOWN IN VAIL, COLORADO, IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR.
BUT THERE WERE TRAILS THAT WE HAVE HERE IN THE MINNESOTA AREA THAT RIVAL THOSE, AS FAR AS THE ENJOYMENT, THE ABILITY TO GET OUT QUICKLY ONTO A TRAIL.
IN THIS AREA, IF YOU LOOK AT A MAP, IF YOU CAN CLICK INTO THE LINKS, THERE WILL BE SOMETHING THAT SHOWS HOW FAR AWAY THE NEAREST TRAILS ARE TO THIS LOCATION.
IT'S A BUMMER BECAUSE WE HAVE THAT LOOSE LINE RIGHT THERE, WHERE PEOPLE ARE CONSTANTLY GOING RIGHT THROUGH THIS TOWN.
THIS PROPOSAL, IT JUST MAKES SO MUCH SENSE TO HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO NOW ENABLE, AND I HEARD PEOPLE MENTION THE YOUTH.
I WAS A COACH FOR ORONO FROM 2017-2024.
I DIDN'T HAVE ANY CHILDREN ON THE TEAM, BUT IT WAS MY OPPORTUNITY TO GET BACK TO MY ALMA MATER.
I WENT THROUGH THE ORONO SCHOOL SYSTEM BACK AS A KID IN THE '80S.
IF ANYONE'S FAMILIAR, WHERE THERE'S NOW A WATER TREATMENT FACILITY IN MAPLE PLAIN, THERE USED TO BE AN ABA BIKE TRACK, SO A BMX TRACK.
SOME OF YOU MAY NOT BE FAMILIAR, BUT I CAN ASSURE YOU, ALMOST EVERY DAY IN THE SUMMER, CROSSING HIGHWAY 12 WAS A LITTLE BIT DAUNTING, BUT WE GOT REALLY GOOD AT THE FROGGER GAMES.
AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE HAD OPPORTUNITIES AS KIDS.
WE'VE HEARD PEOPLE MENTION SCREENS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
IT OPENS THE DOOR TO KIDS HAVING A VERY HEALTHY OPPORTUNITY TO SOMETHING BESIDES THOSE THINGS.
I THINK IT'S GREAT TO SEE THIS ON THERE.
I DIDN'T EVEN REALIZE THAT THIS WAS THE POSSIBILITY IN OUR COMMUNITY TO BE THIS CLOSE.
I RIDE THE LOOSE LINE FOR MY OWN PURPOSES, TRAINING ON A REGULAR BASIS.
I LOVE LOOKING AT THE GOLF COURSE OFF IN THE DISTANCE AS I RIDE BY, BUT IT WOULD BE GREAT TO BE ABLE TO VEER OFF AND RIDE SOME SINGLE TRACK.
I THINK IT'S ONE OF THE BETTER OPPORTUNITIES, AND IF YOU LOOK AT MOUNTAIN BIKING AS A WHOLE, AS MANY OF THE PEOPLE HAVE ALREADY MENTIONED, PEOPLE HAVE A VESTED INTEREST IN MAINTAINING THOSE TRAILS, IF THERE'S GARBAGE ON THE TRAIL, BENDING OVER AND PICKING SOMETHING UP AS WE STOP.
AS PART OF WORKING WITH YOUTH, WE HELP THEM TO UNDERSTAND THE VALUE OF RESPECTING WHAT IT IS THAT YOU GET TO RIDE ON, BECAUSE WE KNOW THE ALTERNATIVES.
AS YOU LOOK AT FIELDS, I HEARD THE MENTION OF DIFFERENT SPORTING AREAS.
AN EXAMPLE IS BEDERWOOD, FOR INSTANCE.
THAT'S WHERE WE'VE SPENT THE BULK OF OUR TIME OVER THE YEARS, BECAUSE IT'S A CENTRAL LOCATION FOR ALL ORONO STUDENTS TO BE ABLE TO COME AND START THERE FOR YOUR PRACTICE.
IF YOU LOOK AT IT, IT'S A REALLY NICE LOOKING SOCCER FIELD RIGHT NOW, THAT'S AT THE BOTTOM OF A SPOT THAT WE USED TO USE, AND WE VERY DILIGENTLY REMINDED OUR STUDENT ATHLETES, HEY, THE SOCCER FIELD, IT'S OFF LIMITS.
AS WE START TO SEE THAT OR FEEL THAT CRUNCHING AWAY OF SPACE, IT JUST MAKES THIS OPPORTUNITY IN FRONT OF US HERE, JUST SEEMS AWESOME.
I HOPE YOU ALL CONSIDER IT AND THINK ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WE HAVE FOR YOUTH, AS WELL AS OLD PEOPLE LIKE ME THAT WANT TO KEEP RIDING. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
>> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? YES, SIR.
[00:30:11]
>> MY NAME IS [INAUDIBLE] WILCOX, 2008 COUNTY ROAD 19.
I HAVE THREE SONS THAT ALL WENT TO ORONO, ALL TOTAL, THERE'S EIGHT GRANDCHILDREN.
I WAS WITH MOST OF THEM THIS LAST WEEKEND.
JUST TO LET YOU KNOW, THEY WEREN'T IN THE HOUSE, [INAUDIBLE] WITH ELECTRONIC STUFF.
THEY WERE ON THEIR BIKES RIDING, AND MOST OF THEM GOT 15-25 MILES.
IT'S A GOOD THING FOR THEM, AND IT'S A GOOD THING THAT THIS IS COMING TO FRUITION, I HOPE. THANK YOU FOR THAT.
I DO RIDE. I JUST STARTED LAST YEAR, AND MY KIDS GOT ME OUT ON MOUNTAIN BIKING.
I'M 78-YEARS-OLD, SO IT'S FOR EVERYBODY.
>> UNLESS I'M TOO SHORT. HELLO, MY NAME IS WILL BECK.
I LIVE AT 266 INDEPENDENCE ROAD, INDEPENDENCE, MINNESOTA.
FIRST OFF, THANK YOU GUYS FOR EVEN CONSIDERING A MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL NEAR ME.
WHERE I LIVE, I HAVE TO RIDE ALL ROAD AND GRAVEL TO GET TO MOUNTAIN BIKE.
FOR ME TO RIDE, I'M AN AVID CYCLIST, I WENT TO A MOUNTAIN BIKE NATIONALS LAST YEAR, AND I JUST COMPLETED A FOUR-DAY ROAD RACE IN IOWA.
I'M ALSO AN AVID GRAVEL RIDER ROAD RACER AND RIDER AND MOUNTAIN BIKER.
BUT YOU GUYS, FOR ME TO RIDE ON THE ROAD, I HAVE TO GET ON MY LIGHTS.
I CAN'T LISTEN TO MUSIC, AND I ALWAYS HAVE TO BE AWARE OF THE DRIVERS THAT ARE ON THEIR PHONES.
IT'S INCREDIBLY SCARY FOR ME TO RIDE ON THE ROADS TO GET TO THE TRAILS THAT I NEED TO GET TO.
DRIVING HOME FROM IOWA, I SAW AT LEAST 10 PEOPLE ON THEIR PHONES DRIVING, AND IT IS INCREDIBLY SCARY.
PEOPLE HAVE ACTUALLY DIED ON THE ROAD LATELY.
IT'S GOTTEN SO BAD THAT MY PARENTS HAVE ACTUALLY ENCOURAGED ME TO STOP RIDING ON THE ROAD AND START RIDING GRAVEL OR MY MOUNTAIN BIKE, MERELY FOR MY SAFETY.
MY SECOND THING WOULD BE THIS.
AS A MOUNTAIN BIKER, AS MY COACH CLOVER SAID, WE DON'T LIKE CUTTING DOWN THE TREES, WE LIKE LEAVING THE TREES.
ALSO, WHERE I RIDE, I RIDE AT THEODORE WIRTH ON CREEK, I THINK HYLAND PARK HAS ONE, AS WELL.
YOU GUYS, THESE FORESTS AREN'T BEING DESTROYED.
THEY'RE ACTUALLY INCREDIBLY VIBRANT, AND THEY'RE VERY GREEN.
YOU GUYS, THE CYCLING COMMUNITY IS ABOUT HAVING FUN.
WE WANT THESE KIDS TO GET OUT AND TO ENJOY LIFE.
A LOT OF CYCLISTS ARE JUST LIKE, WE SHOW UP HERE, WE WANT TO RIDE.
WE JUST WANT TO ENJOY THE MOMENT THAT WE'RE AT.
WE'RE NOT GOING TO GO OUT INTO THE FOREST AND BE CUTTING DOWN MASSIVE TREES THAT ARE LIKE 50 YEARS OLD, WE'RE GOING TO LEAVE THEM AND RIDE AROUND THEM.
IT'S ALSO, FROM A PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, BEEN MASSIVE IN MY DEVELOPMENT AS A HUMAN.
I USED TO STRUGGLE WITH A LOT OF STRESS AND OBSESSIVE COMPULSIVENSS.
CYCLING ACTUALLY BROUGHT THOSE LEVELS SO LOW THAT I WOULD SAY I DON'T EVEN STRUGGLE WITH THEM ANYMORE.
JUST TO BE ABLE TO HAVE KIDS THAT STRUGGLE WITH MENTAL HEALTH AS WELL, CYCLING COULD HONESTLY BRING DOWN THAT MENTAL STRUGGLE WITH DEPRESSION, STRESS, ANXIETY.
WHEN I'M STRESSED, I GO TO MY MOUNTAIN BIKE, WITHIN AN HOUR, I FEEL NO STRESSED, I FEEL CALMER, AND I'M READY TO DO MY HOMEWORK, AND TO ACHIEVE THE THINGS I WANT TO ACHIEVE.
THANK YOU GUYS, HAVE A GREAT REST OF YOUR WEEK.
>> ANYONE ELSE? WELL, WE WILL MOVE ON TO OUR NEXT ITEM,
[9. 2025 Parks Projects]
WHICH IS 2025 PARKS PROJECTS.WHO IS HERE LEADING THAT, ADAM? OH, BOY.
>> MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL.
ITEM NUMBER 1 IS 2025 PARKS PROJECTS.
THERE ARE A NUMBER OF PROJECTS WERE IDENTIFIED BY THE CITY IN THE PARKS CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN FOR VARIOUS STAGES OF ACTIVITY IN 2025.
THERE ARE THREE THAT ARE INCLUDED IN THIS COUNCIL MEMO FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION, AND I'LL JUST GO THROUGH THEM BRIEFLY WITH A BRIEF DESCRIPTION.
FIRST IS HACKBERRY PARK DESIGN.
HACKBERRY PARK, AS WAS PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED DURING PUBLIC COMMENTS, IS ONE OF OUR PLAYFIELD PARKS, AND FOR THE PAST, PROBABLY A COUPLE DECADES, BUT AT LEAST FOR THE PAST DECADE,
[00:35:03]
THE CITY HAS BEEN LOOKING AT WHAT WE WOULD DO TO IMPROVE AND UPGRADE THAT PARK ONCE WE WERE ABLE TO GAIN CONTROL OF ALL OF THE LAND ASSOCIATED WITH IT, WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENED IN 2023.THEN THE CITY DID CONDUCT AN INITIAL FEASIBILITY MASTER PLAN FOR THE PARK IN '23, AND SO NOW WE'RE LOOKING AT MOVING TO THE NEXT PHASE OF THE PROJECT, WHICH WOULD BE TO PUT TOGETHER A DESIGN FOR THAT PARK.
AT THE END OF THE MASTER PLAN, THERE WAS STILL SOME PUBLIC INPUT ON VARIOUS OPTIONS, AND SO THE DESIGN DOES CONTEMPLATE DOING SOME PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT AS PART OF THAT DESIGN TO REFINE THINGS TO WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE ACCEPTABLE.
WE DO WANT TO TRY TO GET THROUGH A DESIGN PROCESS THIS YEAR SO THAT AS THE GRANT WINDOWS OPEN UP FOR VARIOUS GRANT OPPORTUNITIES, WE WOULD HAVE AT LEAST A PRELIMINARY DESIGN TO PROVIDE AS PART OF ANY GRANT PACKET.
THIS PROJECT, BEFORE IT CAN GO TO CONSTRUCTION, IT IS SOMETHING THAT WILL REQUIRE FUNDING OUTSIDE OF JUST OUR PARKS FUND, IT'S QUITE EXPENSIVE.
ITEM NUMBER 2 IS WHAT WE'RE CALLING ANTOINE PARK MASTER PLAN.
IN 2024, THE PARKS COMMISSION DID ASK STAFF TO DEVELOP A PLAN TO ENGAGE THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND TO LOOK AT UPDATES AND AMENITIES FOR ANTOINE PARK.
ANTOINE PARK IS OUT ON FAGERNESS POINT, AND IT IS ONE OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS CURRENTLY CONSISTS OF A PLAYGROUND AND SOME OPEN SPACE.
THE PURPOSE OF THE STUDY WILL BE, ONE, TO ENGAGE WITH THE PUBLIC, AND THEN, TWO, TO EXPLORE WHAT FUTURE OPPORTUNITIES THERE MIGHT BE FOR IMPROVEMENTS, EITHER TO THE EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE OR INFRASTRUCTURE ADDITIONS.
ONE THING THAT WE HAVE HEARD OVER THE YEARS REPEATEDLY FROM THAT NEIGHBORHOOD IS A DESIRE FOR SOME KIND OF PAVILION BECAUSE THE NEIGHBORHOOD DOES USE IT QUITE REGULARLY FOR NEIGHBORHOOD GATHERINGS AND EVENTS.
ITEM NUMBER 3 THAT I HAVE ON THE AGENDA FOR YOU IS A COUNTY ROAD 6 TRAIL RESURFACING.
THIS IS A MAINTENANCE PROPOSAL TO DO SOME MAINTENANCE ON THE PAVEMENT THAT MAKES UP THAT TRAIL.
FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO DON'T KNOW, THERE'S BASICALLY A SQUARE THAT GOES AROUND, INCLUDING THE INDEPENDENCE TRAIL, WHICH IS A REGIONAL TRAIL HERE IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING, WHICH GOES UP TO COUNTY ROAD 6, JUST BEFORE YOU GET TO COUNTY ROAD 6, YOU CAN CATCH THE TRAIL AS IT GOES THROUGH THE BALL FIELDS, AND THEN PARALLELS COUNTY ROAD 6 OVER TO WILLOW DRIVE, AND THEN THERE'S A TRAIL THAT THAT COMES SOUTH FROM THERE BACK TO KELLEY PARKWAY, WHERE YOU CAN TAKE THE SIDEWALK TO COMPLETE THAT LOOP.
THE TRAIL WAS COMPLETED IN THE EARLY 2000S, AND THE PAVEMENT IS IN VARIOUS STATES OF MAINTENANCE NEED, PARTICULARLY ON THE EASTERN END WHERE WE'RE PROBABLY LOOKING AT DOING SOME RECLAMATION AND REPLACEMENT OF THE PAVEMENT.
PERHAPS ON THE WESTERN END, WE MAY BE ABLE TO GET JUST WITH SOME PAVEMENT PRESERVATION, LIKE SOME FOG SKILLING AND CRACK REPAIRS AND PATCHES.
THE PROPOSAL IS FOR US TO USE A CONSULTANT TO COME UP WITH THAT DESIGN AND PLAN.
IN ALL OF THESE CASES, THE DESIGNS AND PLANS, JUST SO YOU'RE AWARE, I KNOW MOST OF YOU ARE NEW, WE GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS WITH THE PARKS COMMISSION AND THE CONSULTANT, AND THEN THOSE DESIGNS DO COME BACK TO THE CITY COUNCIL BEFORE WE CAN MOVE FORWARD WITH ANY LOOK AT AWARD OF ACTUAL CONSTRUCTION IN THE FUTURE.
IN THE PACKET, ARE PROPOSALS FROM BOLTON & MENK, WHO IS OUR CONSULTING ENGINEERING FIRM TO PROVIDE THE VARIOUS CONSULTING SERVICES FOR EACH OF THOSE THREE PROJECTS.
IF THERE ARE ANY QUESTIONS, I'M HAPPY TO DO MY BEST TO ANSWER THEM.
>> TO BE CLEAR, ARE YOU ASKING FOR ESSENTIALLY APPROVAL OF THE BOLTON & MENK, HIRING THEM TO DO THE WORK THAT IS LAID OUT HERE, OR ARE WE APPROVING THE PROJECTS THEMSELVES?
>> NO, SO I'M NOT ASKING FOR APPROVAL OF THE PROJECT.
I'M ASKING FOR APPROVAL OF WHATEVER THE FUNCTION IS.
FOR HACKBERRY IS TO COMPLETE THE DESIGN, FOR ANTOINE, IS TO COMPLETE A MASTER PLAN, AND FOR COUNTY ROAD 6, IT IS TO DO THE DESIGN FOR THE PROJECT.
EACH OF THOSE WILL COME BACK IN THEIR VARIOUS STAGES TO MOVE TO THE NEXT STAGE.
BUT THERE ARE TWO THINGS THAT I'M ASKING FOR, MR. MAYOR, ONE IS APPROVAL OF THE CONSULTING PROPOSAL, AND TWO, IS THE COUNCIL TO DIRECT STAFF TO ACTUALLY UNDERTAKE THESE ACTIVITIES BECAUSE IS A STAFF CONSULTANT AND PARKS COMMISSION, IN MANY CASES, JOINT EFFORT TO GET THROUGH EACH OF THESE.
[00:40:01]
>> JUST TO BE CLEAR ON THE TRAIL PAVEMENT IMPROVEMENT PROJECT, THAT'S JUST THE SECTION ALONG COUNTY ROAD 6, NOT ANY OTHER PART OF THE SQUARE, IT'S JUST THAT ONE SECTION?
>> CORRECT. WE DID A SIMILAR THING ON THE WILLOW DRIVE TRAIL MAYBE FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AGO, WHICH SADLY LOOKS LIKE IT MIGHT NEED US TO COME BACK PRETTY SOON.
BUT NO, THIS IS JUST ON THAT SEGMENT.
THE SEGMENT OUT HERE THAT IS IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING AND RUNS UP OLD CRYSTAL BAY ROAD AND ACTUALLY ALL THE WAY DOWN TO LOOSE LINE IS ACTUALLY OWNED AND MAINTAINED BY THE THREE RIVERS PARK DISTRICT AND THEY DID REACH OUT ACTUALLY A FEW WEEKS AGO TO ME THAT THEY'RE STARTING A PROCESS TO DO A SIMILAR TYPE ACTIVITY ALONG THAT TRAIL.
I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT TIMINGS, BUT THEY JUST ASKED FOR A LETTER OF RECOMMENDATION FOR A GRANT PROPOSAL THEY WERE DOING FOR MAINTENANCE OF THAT TRAIL.
>> OTHER QUESTIONS COUNCIL MEMBERS MIGHT HAVE?
>> AS FAR AS HACKBERRY IS CONCERNED, YOU WANT US TO APPROVE THE PLAN THAT YOU ARE SHOWING US RIGHT HERE, OR IS IT POSSIBLE FOR US TO GO A DIFFERENT DIRECTION?
>> IT'S ABSOLUTELY POSSIBLE TO GO A DIFFERENT DIRECTION.
WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR APPROVAL ON IS TO BEGIN THE DESIGN PROCESS, AND PART OF THAT PROCESS IS MORE ENGAGEMENT.
YES, THE FEASIBILITY STUDY IS THERE AS A GUIDE SO WE KNOW ROUGHLY WHAT THE ART OF THE POSSIBLE IS AT THAT PARK AND WHAT WE THINK THE VARIOUS EXPENSES ASSOCIATED WITH THAT ARE.
ONCE WE GET INTO THE DESIGN, WE START REFINING THAT AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT EXACTLY, PARTICULARLY IN THIS PROJECT, WHAT DO WE WANT TO ACCOMPLISH AND REFINING THE SCOPE OF THOSE THINGS TO GET A BETTER IDEA OF WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST TO DO.
>> I GUESS I'LL SPEAK OF HACKBERRY, THAT I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF GETTING RID OF THE T BALL FIELDS, I AM IN FAVOR OF GETTING RID OF THE DRAINAGE ISSUES THAT THEY HAVE, I THINK WE NEED TO ADDRESS THE PARKING, BUT I CERTAINLY DON'T FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO TAKE A SIXTH OF THE PARK AND PUT IT UNDER PAVEMENT.
THAT DOESN'T FEEL RIGHT TO ME.
I LIKE THE FACT THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE A HISTORY OF USAGE AT THAT PARK THAT IN THE AREAS OF THE T BALL, AND FOR THE OLD ICE RINK, AND THE FLAG FOOTBALL, I GUESS I DON'T REALLY WANT TO INTERFERE WITH THAT.
I HAVE HEARD FROM ONE OF THE NEIGHBORS THAT SAID THAT POSSIBLY A COVERED PICNIC AREA WOULD BE NICE AS A DREAM.
BUT I HAVE A VERY HARD TIME WITH WHAT'S PRESENTED HERE.
I TEND TO WANT TO LEAVE IT HOW IT IS, BUT I WANT TO GET RID OF THE DEAD TREES AND GET THE STOPS STRAIGHTENED OUT, GET THE BENCHES STRAIGHTENED OUT, AND FIX THE DRAINAGE ISSUE.
SOMEHOW, IF WE CAN GET SOME DIRECTION ON HOW WE COULD HAVE PEOPLE PARK THERE SO THAT IT'D BE SAFE FOR THE COMMUNITY AND SAFE FOR THE PEOPLE WHO ARE VISITING THE PARK AS WELL.
>> MANY OF THOSE FEATURES THAT YOU JUST MENTIONED ARE EXACTLY WHAT WE NEED TO WORK OUT IN THE DESIGN.
PARKING AT THAT PARK IS UNSATISFACTORY RIGHT NOW AND UNSAFE.
WE'VE GONE THROUGH A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT PARKING ITERATIONS, SO CERTAINLY FIGURING AND REFINING WHICH WAY WE WANT TO GO.
>> EVEN IF THAT MEANS PARKING ON THE GRASS, I GUESS, BECAUSE WE DON'T DO IT FOR THAT LONG.
IF YOU'RE PARKING ON THE GRASS ON THE SIDE, WHEN YOU PULL IN, IF THERE'S A DIAGONAL DIRECTION OR SOMETHING, I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT IT THAT CLOSELY TO KNOW EXACTLY AND KNOW WHAT THE PARKING NEED IS, BUT I GUESS THAT'S WHERE I WOULD FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE GOING RATHER THAN US PAVING IT OVER.
>> WELL, I'M STRUCK BY, WE'VE SAID THIS BEFORE, THAT WE HAVE A NEW COUNCIL.
WE ALSO HAVE THESE PROPOSALS AND THIS PROJECT IN PARTICULAR HAS CERTAINLY BEEN, AS SOMEBODY MENTIONED EARLIER, THIS PARK HAS BEEN IN NEED OF DRAINAGE ISSUES FOR SOME TIME.
I THINK WHAT I'M STRUGGLING WITH RIGHT NOW IS WE'RE BEING ASKED TO ENGAGE WITH AN ENGINEER FOR THE BEGINNING STAGES OF A DESIGN OR AT LEAST LOOKING AT THIS PROJECT WHEN WE'VE JUST SWORN IN ONE NEW COUNCIL MEMBER.
WE HAVE THREE OTHERS WHO WE HAVE NOT BEEN BRIEFED AS A COUNCIL ON ANY OF THESE PARTS, WHETHER IT BE HACKBERRY, OR ANTOINE, AND EVEN THE TRAIL.
WHAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO VOTE ON TONIGHT IS TO PROCEED WITH AN APPROVAL TO ENGAGE, AND FROM MY PERSPECTIVE THERE SHOULD BE, WHEN WE JUST TALKED ABOUT THE SECTION OF THE WORK SESSION, MY OPINION IS THERE SHOULD BE SOME AGREEMENT ON THE PART OF THE COUNCIL OR
[00:45:03]
DESIRE TO ACTUALLY PROCEED WITH ENGAGEMENT OF DESIGN SERVICES.RIGHT NOW, WE JUST DISCUSSED IN THE WORK SESSION, THE IDEA OF NEEDING TO SORT OF GET OUR ARMS AROUND WHAT HAS EVEN BEEN PRIORITIZED RECENTLY IN PARKS AND BEING CONFRONTED WITH A NOT TO EXCEED, AND PROJECT MANAGEMENT, AND ALL THESE OTHER THINGS ON TWO DIFFERENT PARKS, TO ME, FEELS PREMATURE GIVEN THAT, AGAIN, THERE'S A NEW PARKS COMMISSION, AT LEAST FOUR FOLKS WHO HAVE BEEN APPOINTED AFTER THIS WAS DISCUSSED AS WELL AS A NEW COUNCIL.
MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE HERE WOULD BE TO EITHER TABLE OR THINK ABOUT MAYBE GETTING MORE INFORMATION ON WHAT PROJECTS ARE MOST NECESSARY DOING MORE COMPREHENSIVE PLANNING OR ASSESSMENT OF CITY PARKS BEFORE ENGAGING ON THIS ONE AND ON ANTOINE, BECAUSE OF, AGAIN, I DON'T FEEL LIKE THERE'S A GREAT DEGREE OF UNDERSTANDING OF SOME OF THESE ISSUES ON THE COUNCIL'S PART.
I'M SPEAKING AS SOMEBODY WHO'S BEEN HERE A COUPLE OF YEARS, BUT MOST HAVE NOT.
AGAIN, FOR ME NOT HAVING THE HISTORY BEHIND HOW THIS DESIGN LANDED, AND I'VE READ SOME DOCUMENTS AND EXECUTIVE SUMMARIES, MY PERSPECTIVE ON PARKS IS THAT WE HAVE A REAL NEED TO STEP BACK AND MAKE SOME DECISIONS AROUND WHERE WE WANT TO COMMIT OUR RESOURCES, SPECIFICALLY ASSOCIATED WITH THE STANDARDS THAT WE OURSELVES HAVE PUBLISHED.
IN THE CITY OF ORONO, WE HAVE PUBLISHED A DOCUMENT THAT REALLY SPELLS OUT WHAT THOSE STANDARDS ARE, WHETHER THEY'RE PARKING, WHETHER THEY'RE BENCHES, OR THE WAY THAT DIFFERENT THINGS ARE TAKEN CARE OF, TABLES, BENCHES, GARBAGE CANS.
WHEN I LOOK AROUND OUR PARK SIGNAGE, WHEN I GO TO PARKS AND I TRAVEL AROUND, I COULDN'T TELL YOU PROBABLY THE LAST TIME THAT MAYBE AN ASSESSMENT WAS DONE.
THERE WAS JENNY ON THE PARK BOARD TOOK SOME TIME TO JUST CREATE ON HER OWN AN INVENTORY.
THIS INVENTORY IS REFLECTIVE OF THE STANDARDS THAT WE AS A CITY HAVE PUBLISHED.
THIS, TO ME, IS A GREAT STEP TOWARDS IDENTIFYING WHERE WE SHOULD BE INVESTING IN OUR PARKS AT LEAST INITIALLY, RATHER THAN MAKING LARGE-SCALE CHANGES AS OPPOSED TO POTENTIALLY TAKING STEPS TO STAND OUR PARKS UP IN A WAY THAT WE'VE ALREADY SAID ARE THE STANDARDS THAT WE WANT TO HAVE IN ORONO, AND WHEN YOU GO TO A PARK, YOU SEE THE STANDARDS, IT'S REFLECTED IN EVERY PARK WE HAVE, AND WE CAN TAKE PRIDE IN JUST THE BRANDING AND OUR COMMITMENT TO MAINTAINING PARKS IN A WAY THAT WE'VE SAID WE WILL.
FOR ME, IT'S LESS ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THIS DESIGN AT HACKBERRY IS EVEN THE RIGHT ONE.
IT'S MORE TO ME AROUND MOVING IN A DIRECTION WHERE WE CAN ASSESS OUR PARKS, IDENTIFY STANDARDS, IDENTIFY THE NEEDS, APPLY THOSE NEEDS TO OUR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN, TAKE STEPS TO INVEST IN THOSE, AND ALONG THE WAY, ALSO TAKE A LOOK AT WHERE WE WANT TO MAKE LARGER SCALE INVESTMENTS, BASED UPON THE FEEDBACK THAT WE'VE GOTTEN FROM NEIGHBORS, ASSOCIATIONS, WHETHER IT'S T BALL OR MULTI-USE FIELDS, AND THEN TAKE STEPS TO INVEST IN OUR PARKS IN A WAY THAT MEETS THE NEEDS OF THE SPORTING ORGANIZATIONS AS WELL.
>> JON, DO YOU HAVE ANY THOUGHTS, QUESTIONS?
>> BEING A PERSON WHO COACHED TEE-BALL AND FLAG FOOTBALL AT HACKBERRY, I SPENT A FAIR AMOUNT OF TIME THERE.
IT'S A GREAT COMMUNITY GATHERING PLACE.
I LOOK AT HACKBERRY, AND I DRIVE BY THERE, I GO.
IT'S A GREAT PARK FACILITY FOR US TO HAVE.
IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY, IS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS TO JUST BE ABLE TO ASSESS WHETHER WHAT THE DESIGN SHOULD BE NEEDS AND SO FORTH ON THAT.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE VOTING TO APPROVE TODAY.
>> IS THAT PROCESS, WHICH WOULD TAKE US FROM WHERE WE WERE TO HAVING A DESIGN THAT ULTIMATELY WOULD BE CONSTRUCTION-READY.
>> THAT DESIGN COULD HAVE INPUT OR WHATEVER IN REGARDS TO THAT.
WE'RE NOT VOTING ON ANYTHING TO SAY, YEAH, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE DOING.
I UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT STEVE WAS SAYING.
[00:50:01]
THEY'RE TAKING THAT INVENTORY AND LOOKING AT WHERE WE ARE IN OUR PARKS, AND WHERE DO WE WANT TO BE AND MOVING ON FROM THERE, PRIORITIZING, TAKING THAT INVENTORY, TAKING THAT STEP BACK.A LONG-TIME COUNCIL MEMBER, I'VE REALLY DUG INTO THIS A WHOLE LOT.
THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE, TO ME, UNDERSTANDING THAT AND KNOWING THAT WE'VE GOT A GREAT PARKS COMMISSION GOING ON AND WITH NEW BLOOD IN THERE.
BUT ALSO, I THINK FOR US, AS COUNCIL MEMBERS, AT LEAST, I CAN SPEAK FOR MYSELF HERE IS THAT I WANT TO BE OPEN TO EVERYTHING.
THERE'S TWO SIDES TO EVERYTHING.
THERE'S OPPOSING, THERE'S AS FAR AS NEEDS, AND WHERE DO WE GO, BUT I WANT TO BE COGNIZANT OF BOTH THOSE THINGS AND SEEING WHAT'S IMPORTANT AND IDENTIFY WITH THAT.
WHAT I WANT TO SAY IS THAT WHAT I HAVE SEEN WITH THE NEW COUNCIL AND MAYOR HERE, A GOOD MOMENTUM GOING FORWARD.
LET'S KEEP THAT AS FAR AS WE CAN KEEP THAT GOING, WHATEVER THAT LOOKS LIKE.
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? WHEN I'M STUMBLING AND REPEATING MYSELF, I KNOW IT'S TIME FOR ME TO BE QUIET.
>> I JUST WANTED TO COMMENT A LITTLE FURTHER.
ONE OF THE THINGS I WANT TO MAKE SURE IS THE DESIGN THAT WE'VE SEEN WITH THE MULTI-SPACE AREA IN THE TEE-BALL FIELD, I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S THE WAY THAT WOULD END UP.
I THINK THAT PART OF ME THINKS THAT GIVEN THE NEWNESS THAT WE HAVE, I WOULD BE INTERESTED IN JUST ANOTHER ROUND OF DISCUSSIONS WITH THE KEY USERS OF THE SPACE TO SAY, TWO TEE-BALL FIELDS REALLY MAKE SENSE HERE.
WE CAN EITHER FIX WHAT WE HAVE OR WE CAN SPEND SOME MORE SUBSTANTIAL MONEY TO MAKE SOMETHING WITH BETTER PARKING, BETTER DRAINAGE SHELTER, WHATEVER THE CASES MIGHT BE ALL THESE ELEMENTS.
I'M NOT SURE IF WE APPROVE THIS, THAT WE CAN TWEAK THE DESIGN BECAUSE MY SENSE IS THAT THE WORK THAT THEY'RE DOING IS BASED UPON THE RENDERING THAT THEY HAVE.
THAT'S WHERE I BECOME CONCERNED THAT IF WE MOVE FORWARD, WE'D RUN THE RISK OF LANDING IN A SPACE WHERE ULTIMATELY THE USERS OF THE SPACE MIGHT SAY THAT'S ACTUALLY NOT ANYWHERE NEAR WHAT WE NEED.
>> I GUESS I TAKE THE VIEWPOINT THAT IT'S ACKNOWLEDGED BY THE NEIGHBORHOOD, WE HEARD IT EARLIER, THAT THE PARK NEEDS TO BE REFRESHED.
I DON'T THINK ANYTHING THAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO DO TONIGHT LOCKS US INTO ANY PARTICULAR DESIGN OR ANY PARTICULAR SET OF FIELDS.
THE COMMUNITY INPUT CAN BE OBTAINED DURING THIS PROCESS.
IF IT'S BASICALLY FIXING THE DRAINAGE AND THE PARKING AND HAVING THE FIELDS BE EXACTLY WHAT THEY'RE DOING RIGHT NOW, THAT MIGHT BE A GREAT RESULT, AND I DON'T SEE US BEING LOCKED INTO THAT BY WHAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO VOTE ON TONIGHT.
I THINK WE'VE GOT TWO PARKS THAT NEED REFRESHMENT, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD.
WE'VE GOT A TRAIL THAT NEEDS FIXING.
I'M INCLINED TO SUPPORT THE THINGS THAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO DO TONIGHT BECAUSE I DON'T SEE THAT WE'RE BEING LOCKED INTO ANY PARTICULAR DESIGN.
WE'RE BEING ASKED TO FIX A PROBLEM.
WE'VE GOT THAT LOT THAT HAD A LIFE ESTATE ON IT OR WHATEVER THAT HAS NOW BEEN FREED UP.
SEEMS LIKE IT'S THE TIME TO DO THAT.
WE CAN TAKE INTO ACCOUNT ALL THE THINGS YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, THE BRANDING, THE LOOK, THE THE QUALITY THAT WE WANT TO HAVE ASSOCIATED WITH ORONO.
I DON'T SEE THAT WE'RE GOING DOWN A PATH THAT LOCKS US INTO SOMETHING THAT IS DIFFERENT FROM THAT.
>> I GUESS I WAS JUST GOING TO ADD BASED ON SOME OF THE THINGS I'M HEARING ABOUT HACKBERRY.
IF THERE IS A DESIRE BY THE COUNCIL TO DO A MORE IN-DEPTH REDO OF SOME OF THE MASTER PLANNING LEVEL STUFF, WE CAN CERTAINLY INCORPORATE THAT.
ONE THING IF COUNSEL SO DIRECTED IS WE CAN DIVIDE THIS THING UP INTO PHASES AND SAY, WE'RE GOING TO DO A, CALL IT A PRELIMINARY DESIGN LAYOUT PHASE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
WE WILL BE DIRECTED TO BRING THAT BACK THROUGH THE PARKS COMMISSION AND TO THE COUNCIL FOR YOUR REVIEW BEFORE WE MOVE THEN INTO DETAILED DESIGN AND WORKING UP SPEC SHEETS AND ALL THAT STUFF SO THAT WE COULD DO IT PHASED IF THAT ADDED A BIGGER COMFORT LEVEL.
[00:55:05]
THERE'S NO NECESSARY RUSH ON THIS OTHER THAN KEEPING IT MOVING SO THAT WHEN WE GET TO THE RIGHT POINT, WE CAN GO AFTER THE FUNDING THAT WE WILL NEED TO DO IT, AND EVENTUALLY GET TO IT BECAUSE WE HAVE BEEN DEFERRING MAINTENANCE ON A LOT OF THINGS AT THAT PARK, KNOWING THAT, WE HAD A REFRESH COMING.>> IT NEEDS WORK. THERE'S NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.
>> WE NEED TO GET AFTER SOME OF THAT STUFF SOONER RATHER THAN LATER, BUT WE'RE NOT IN A SUPER RUSH, I GUESS.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT ANTOINE.
THESE ARE ALL LINKED TOGETHER, OR CAN WE TALK ABOUT THESE SEPARATELY, BECAUSE IT'S NOT CLEAR TO ME THAT WE WOULD NECESSARILY NEED TO DO, ANTOINE? HERE'S MY CONCERN. HOW MANY MASTER PLANS DO WE CURRENTLY HAVE FOR CITY PARKS?
>> TOP OF MY HEAD, LET'S SEE, WE HAVE SUMMIT BEACH.
WE DID BEDERWOOD, BUT THEN WE DID THIS.
THERE IS ONE FROM THE 1990S FOR CRYSTAL BAY PARK THAT I FOUND THE OTHER DAY.
>> GOLF COURSE MASTER PLAN FROM 2017.
>> HERE'S MY THINKING IS THAT IT COSTS MONEY.
AT LEAST IN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS THAT I'VE BEEN HERE EVERY TIME WE TALK ABOUT A MASTER PLAN, IT'S THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS.
MY CONCERN IS THAT WE CAN MAKE APPROVALS TO MAKE MASTER PLANS, BUT IF THESE PLANS, FOR EXAMPLE, IF SUMMIT BEACH OR ANY OF THE OTHERS, THEN SIT ON OUR SHELVES, AND WE'RE NOT TAKING STEPS BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE FUNDING THEM, THEN THEY BECOME OUTDATED.
MY CONCERN IS WE CAN GO THROUGH THE PROCESS, WE CAN GET THE EVALUATION, WE CAN GET THE INPUT, AND ALL THAT STUFF.
IF WE'RE NOT PREPARED AS A CITY TO ACT UPON THESE IN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME BECAUSE OUR PARKS FUNDING DOES NOT HAVE A LOT OF DOLLARS IN IT, AND WE'RE REQUIRING THAT PRIVATE OR GRANT DOLLARS ARE GOING TO FUND THESE, I'M NOT REALLY INTERESTED IN HAVING A BACKLOG OF MASTER PLANS AND GOING THROUGH THAT PROCESS ONLY TO HAVE THEM SIT FOR A VERY LONG TIME BECAUSE THESE ARE DOLLARS THAT COULD BE SPENT ON OTHER THINGS AS WE JUST DISCUSSED IN OUR WORK SESSION.
PARKS DO NEED A LOT OF ATTENTION AND ALL OF THESE A DOLLAR IS A DOLLAR.
ULTIMATELY, IF WE'RE SPENDING MONEY ON ANTOINE, IT MEANS THAT GRANTED HACKBERRY HAS THE DRAINAGE ISSUES, LONG TIME.
I'M LESS FAMILIAR WITH ANTOINE, BUT I WOULD ARGUE THAT A PAVILION, WHILE IT'S GOOD TO HAVE, NICE TO HAVE, IS NOT A NEED TO HAVE WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE AND PARK STANDARDS, PARK SIGNAGE, ALL OF THESE ADD UP.
I'M AMENABLE AND CAN UNDERSTAND THE NEED AT HACKBERRY.
I WOULDN'T KNOW THAT I WOULD QUALIFY AS A NEED.
IS IT A WANT TO DO ANTOINE? MAYBE WE SHOULD TALK ABOUT THAT A LITTLE MORE THOROUGHLY BECAUSE THESE ARE DOLLARS THAT MATTER ON THE CONTINUUM.
>> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION FROM THE BEGINNING, NO, THESE DON'T ALL HAVE TO.
I PUT THEM ALL TOGETHER ON ONE COUNCIL ACTION BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL RELATIVELY RELATED AS 2025 PARKS, BUT IF THE COUNCIL COULD APPROVE ONE, DENY THE OTHER, MODIFY A THIRD, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO DO THIS EVENING, OR TABLE IT, WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE, EACH SEPARATELY.
>> I AGREE WITH [INAUDIBLE] I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I HAVE CLARIFICATION.
ONE OF THE THINGS I'M LOOKING AT FOR THE HACKBERRY PARK, SERVICES FROM BOLTON & MENK, HALF OF THE COST OF WHAT WE'RE APPROVING IS WORK AROUND THE DESIGN THAT WE SEE IN THE RENDERING.
ESSENTIALLY, WE'D BE SPENDING $46,500 ON SOMETHING THAT WE MAY ULTIMATELY SAY, WE WANT TO GO BACK TO TWO TEE-BALL FIELDS IN A DIFFERENT WAY OF LAYING OUT THAT ENTIRE SPACE.
WE POTENTIALLY END UP SPENDING ANOTHER $46,000 TO REDESIGN WHAT WE'RE ASKING THEM TO DO BASED UPON THE RENDERING THAT THEY'RE WORKING OFF OF.
>> THAT'S WHY I WAS PROPOSING BEFORE WE AGGREGATE.
ONE IS THE WAY THAT JUST AS HOW WE DO PROPOSALS FROM OUR ENGINEERING FIRM, THEY'RE NOT TO EXCEED PROPOSALS.
WHAT THEY'RE GIVING US IS, NO MATTER WHAT, IT WON'T GO PAST THIS, AS LONG AS WE DON'T CHANGE THE GENERAL SCOPE ON THEM.
BUT THAT ALLOWS US FLEXIBILITY AS WE WORK WITH THAT CONSULTANT, IF THINGS CHANGE, IF WE WANT TO SLOW THINGS DOWN IF WE DON'T WANT TO PROCEED TO THE NEXT PART OF WHATEVER THAT ACTIVITY IS THAT DESIGN, WE DON'T HAVE TO.
[01:00:01]
APPROVE THE HACKBERRY DESIGN, YOU'RE NOT SAYING THAT BOLTON & MENK IS GOING TO GET WHATEVER THE FEE IS NO MATTER WHAT.NO, THEY'RE GOING TO DO WHAT WE DIRECT THEM TO DO AS FAR AS STAGING IT OR PHASING IT, AND WHAT HAVE YOU.
IT'S NOT A LUMP SUM PROPOSAL, IT IS A NOT-TO-EXCEED PROPOSAL, WHICH GIVES US A LOT MORE CONTROL ON HOW WE MANAGE THEIR TIME.
THAT'S WHY I WAS SAYING, IF THE COUNCIL ALSO WANTED TO GIVE DIRECTION, HEY, WE WANT TO SPEND MORE TIME UPFRONT ON SOME MASTER PLANNING, WE'LL DO THAT.
I WILL ALSO PROBABLY GET A UPDATED PROPOSAL FROM THEM SAYING, WELL, IF WE'RE GOING TO DO FIVE MORE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENTS OR WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE, THIS IS THE STAFF TIME IT'S GOING TO COST, AND SO IT WOULD ALTER YOUR PROPOSAL IN SUCH A MANNER.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE CLEAR THAT WHEN YOU APPROVE THESE, PARTICULARLY WHEN THEY'RE CALLED NOT TO EXCEED, WE'RE SAYING THAT YES, WE WILL SPEND UP TO THAT AMOUNT TO ACCOMPLISH THOSE THINGS, BUT IT IS NOT, LIKE IN OTHER INSTANCES WHERE WE'RE DOING A LUMP SUM BID OR AWARD WHERE YOU'RE GETTING $50,000, WHETHER YOU DO THIS MUCH OR THAT MUCH BECAUSE WE JUST AWARDED IT TO YOU.
HOPEFULLY, I'M EXPLAINING THAT WELL.
>> I'M SORRY. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I'M CLEAR ON THIS BECAUSE I'M JUST LOOKING AT THIS, AND IT SAYS, AS A PART OF THIS, THERE'S AN ELEMENT CALLED DESIGN.
IT SAYS BOLTON & MENK WILL ADVANCE THE APPROVAL OF MASTER PLAN CONCEPT OF 60% DESIGN DEVELOPMENT, 100% CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS, AND PROJECT SPECS.
ELEMENTS FOR THE DESIGN TO BE DEVELOPED DURING THIS TASK INCLUDE MULTI-USE FIELDS, ONE SOFTBALL, TEE FIELD, SIDEWALKS, A HUGE PARKING LOT.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IF WE APPROVE THIS, WE'RE NOT LOCKED INTO THIS PARTICULAR DESIGN.
>> I HAVE THE SAME QUESTION, AND IT WAS EVEN IN THE REPORT HERE.
I THINK WHEN THIS MASTER PLAN WAS FIRST APPROVED, THERE WAS A 4-1 VOTE, I WAS THE ONE BECAUSE I WASN'T COMFORTABLE WITH THE PLAN.
I WASN'T COMFORTABLE WITH THE FEEDBACK I'D HAD ABOUT THE PROCESS.
I THINK THAT'S THE WORD THAT'S COME UP A LOT WITH OUR PARKS THAT CAME UP AGAIN DURING OUR WORK SESSION IS HOW WE GET HERE AND HOW WE'VE GOTTEN HERE.
I'VE WALKED IT WITH NEIGHBORS, I'VE WALKED IT WITH PAST STAFF, THAT THE IRRIGATION, THE DRAINAGE ISSUES, AND THE NEIGHBORHOOD CONCERNS HAVE GONE ON FOR FAR TOO LONG.
THEY'RE NOT UP TO ORONO STANDARDS, AND THERE ARE A LOT OF REALLY GOOD IDEAS AND REALLY GREAT USE OF THAT PARK.
IF WHAT IS BEFORE US TONIGHT IS THE ABILITY OF THIS COUNCIL TO DIRECT STAFF TO ENGAGE WITH BOLTON & MENK TO START A PROCESS TO FIGURE OUT WHAT DO WE NEED IN THIS PARK AND THIS COUNCIL IS GOING TO BE IN FULL CONTROL OF THOSE DOLLARS AND OF THAT PROCESS AS IT PLAYS OUT, THEN I AM COMFORTABLE MOVING FORWARD BECAUSE THIS HAS BEEN AN ISSUE THAT'S COME UP IN THE LAST TWO YEARS THAT I'VE BEEN HERE, AND I KNOW IT'S WELL PRECEDED MY TIME ON COUNCIL.
I THINK THERE MAY BE SOME HESITATION, AND I'VE GOTTEN EMAILS ABOUT THIS OVER THE PAST FEW DAYS BECAUSE WHAT PEOPLE WHO GAVE INPUT ON THIS PARK TALKED ABOUT, AND THEN WHAT WAS PRESENTED IN THIS PLAN THAT WE'RE SEEING BEFORE US, WE'RE NOT IN ALIGNMENT.
THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT ANY ONE PERSON IS GOING TO DIRECT THIS PROCESS.
BUT WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT WE WILL HAVE THE ABILITY AS WE MOVE THROUGH THIS PROCESS, TO DO THE ENGAGEMENT TO TALK ABOUT DRAINAGE, TEE-BALL, USAGE, PARKING, AND TO COME TOGETHER AND CONTINUE THAT DISCUSSION FORWARD AS WE'RE SEEING THIS PROCESS UNFOLD.
IF THAT IS THE CASE, THEN I'M COMFORTABLE.
>> THE ONLY THING I'M GOING TO ADD TO THAT IS THAT, AND I THINK THIS IS MY INITIAL QUESTION IS, WE'RE NOT MARRING OR APPROVING ANYTHING OTHER THAN WE'RE GOING TO START A PROCESS HERE TO LOOK AT AND IDENTIFY, GET FEEDBACK AGAIN FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS IS THE PARK COMMISSION HAS DONE WORK.
THEY HAVE, AND YOU KNOW WHAT, AS PART OF WHAT WE DO, THEY'RE RECOMMENDING BODY TO US.
I'LL TELL YOU, 10 YEARS AGO, WHEN I COACHED TEE-BALL THERE, IT WAS WET.
YOU'D HAVE RAIN, YOU'D HAVE ALL OF THAT.
GIVES THE KIDS LESS DANDELIONS TO PICK.
THEN, SAME THING THAT HAPPENED IN THE FALL FOR THE FLAG FOOTBALL IS THAT A GOOD PART OF THAT FIELD WASN'T BEING ABLE TO USED DURING THOSE TIMES.
YOU'RE ALWAYS ON A CRUNCH TIME FOR UTILIZING IN THOSE THINGS.
I THINK IF THIS HELPS US TO GET THAT PROCESS BECAUSE PART OF WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT EVEN AT THE WORK SESSION WAS,
[01:05:02]
WE WANT TO HAVE A SET STANDARD.THIS GETS US A BEGINNING OF A DISCUSSION THAT TAKES IT FROM TABLING TO WE'RE GOING TO BEGIN.
IS THAT MY UNDERSTANDING ON IT? WE'RE NOT COMMITTING TO ANYTHING.
>> ADAM, CAN YOU PULL UP THE CIP DOCUMENT?
>> JUST SO THEY KNOW WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. IT'S ONE OF THE ATTACHMENTS.
I THINK IT'S THE THIRD ONE IN THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT.
JUST SO PEOPLE KNOW HOW WE'RE SAYING, WE'RE NOT LOCKING INTO THIS DESIGN, BUT WE'RE MOVING FORWARD WITH SOME APPROVALS.
>> I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY THAT.
AGAIN, I AGREE WITH YOU, JOHN.
IF WE'RE ABLE TO NOT SPEND ALL THIS MONEY TO THIS AND BE ABLE TO GO BACK AND RE-ENGAGE WITH THE CITIZENS, TALK TO ASSOCIATIONS, UNDERSTAND THEIR NEEDS, THE KEY USERS OF THIS PARK, AND THE NEIGHBORS AROUND THERE, THAT'S WHAT I THINK IS IMPORTANT.
>> I THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT AT THE SAME TIME TO WHILE WE'RE DEVELOPING THE DESIGN IS TO DEVELOP OUR STANDARDS AS WELL.
I'M HOPING THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN DO AT THE SAME TIME.
>> ANYBODY CARE TO MAKE A MOTION?
>> ARE WE VOTING ON ALL OF THEM?
>> WE CAN SPLIT IT UP ENTERTAIN WHATEVER MOTION YOU WANT TO MAKE.
>> I THOUGHT IT WAS INTERESTING TO HAVE THESE THREE TOGETHER.
>> ADAM, WE CAN EITHER DISCUSS THE OTHER TWO OR I'D BE COMFORTABLE MAKING A MOTION ON THIS ONE, BUT THEY'RE ALL WRITTEN TOGETHER SO I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU WANT TO PROCEED WITH THAT.
>> IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S SOME DIFFERENT IDEAS ON THE THREE DIFFERENT THINGS, SO MAYBE IT MAKES SENSE JUST TO SEPARATE THEM.
>> I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE, I SHOULD I SAY ENGAGEMENT WITH BOLTON & MENK FOR DESIGN OF HACKBERRY PARK.
I HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME HERE, ADAM.
IS THERE SOMETHING ELSE I NEED TO INCLUDE IN THAT?
>> TO MOVE TO DIRECT STAFF TO IMPLEMENT DESIGN WORK FOR HACKBERRY PARK AND TO ACCEPT A PROPOSAL FROM BOLTON & MENK TO PROVIDE CONSULTING SERVICES FOR THE SAME.
>> DO WE NEED TO INCLUDE NOT TO EXCEED IN THAT MOTION?
>> NOT NECESSARILY BECAUSE AS PROPOSED.
>> VERY GOOD. WE HAVE A NEW CITY ATTORNEY. SORRY ABOUT THAT.
I'LL MOVE TO ENGAGE OR APPROVE THIS PROCESS TO ENGAGE WITH BOLTON & MENK TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE DESIGN PLAN FOR HACKBERRY PARK MASTER PLAN.
>> IS THERE A SECOND TO THAT MOTION?
>> FURTHER DISCUSSION. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
>> ALL THOSE OPPOSED, SAME SIGN.
>> JUST TO BE CLEAR, WE'RE NOT APPROVING WHAT'S DRAWN UP RIGHT THERE.
>> NO. I KNOW THAT'S CAUSED A LOT OF CONSTERNATION.
EXACTLY. THAT IS JUST A MASTER PLAN DRAWING BECAUSE WE NEED SOMETHING TO TALK ABOUT THE ELEMENTS THAT WE WANT AT THE PARK AND THEN FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH THEY COST.
IT DOESN'T LOCK US INTO A PARTICULAR ORIENTATION OF A FIELD OR YOU COULD POTENTIALLY SWAP THE MULTI USE FIELD FOR A SECOND T BALL FIELD.
WE CAN PUT PARKING ON THE SIDE VERSUS THE CENTER, BUT THE WHOLE POINT OF IT IS AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE KNOW ABOUT HOW MUCH FIELD SPACE WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT WHEN WE'RE DOING GRADING AND DRAINAGE WORK AND WE KNOW ABOUT HOW MUCH PARKING WE GOT TO FIGURE OUT, AND WE KNOW ALL THE OTHER SUNDRY THINGS LIKE THE STORMWATER AND THINGS THAT SUPPORT THAT.
WE'RE NOT TIED TO THIS PARTICULAR LAYOUT.
AS WAS MENTIONED, THIS IS A RELATIVELY SMALL PARK, SO THERE'S ONLY SO MANY OPTIONS ON HOW YOU CAN ARRANGE THESE THINGS, BUT GIVEN THOSE CONSTRAINTS THAT YOU'RE NOT TIED TO THIS.
>> WITH THE GRANT FUNDING FOR THIS ONE, IN PARTICULAR, BECAUSE THAT'S COME UP BEFORE AS WELL.
HOW WILL THAT BE PART OF THIS PROCESS?
>> THIS ONE, WE WILL MOST LIKELY LOOK AT THE HENNEPIN COUNTY YOUTH SPORTS FACILITY GRANT,
[01:10:01]
WHICH IS THEIR BIGGER GRANT.I THINK THAT ONE YOU CAN GET UP TO $300,000 IF THEY HAVEN'T INCREASED IT RECENTLY.
THEY CHANGED THEIR GRANT CYCLE, SO THEY DO THOSE IN THE FALL.
IF WE HAD A DESIGN AT THAT POINT BY THIS FALL WHEN THEY WERE ASKING FOR SUBMISSIONS WE'D USE THAT WITH THE GRANT PROPOSAL.
OTHERWISE, WE WOULD KEEP WORKING AND BE READY FOR THE NEXT GRANT CYCLE.
ALL OF THE GRANT CYCLES THAT WE WOULD PURSUE FOR ANY OF OUR PARKS ARE ON AN ANNUAL BASIS SO IF WE'RE NOT QUITE READY, WE JUST PUT IT IN TO THE NEXT CYCLE.
>> HOW ABOUT THE OTHER TWO PROJECTS? YOU WANT TO DISCUSS? ANYBODY WANT TO MAKE A MOTION?
>> CAN I ASK ONE QUESTION ABOUT WHERE WERE THESE PICTURES TAKEN? BECAUSE I DO NOT KNOW WHERE ON THE TRAIL THERE'S THE WHITE LIGHT POSTS.
>> I AM NOT SURE WHERE IT GOT THOSE THAT PARTICULAR PICTURE.
>> BECAUSE YOU'RE SAYING IT'S JUST THE ROAD PARALLEL TO 6?
>> CORRECT. IF YOU GO RIGHT UP HERE TO WHERE LEE CARLSON SPORTS FIELDS ARE THAT'S WHERE THAT SEGMENT OF TRAIL STARTS.
IT WINDS ITS WAY UP JUST TO THE NORTH SIDE OF THE BALL FIELDS, THEN PARALLELS COUNTY ROAD 6 ALL THE WAY OVER TO WILLOW.
>> BECAUSE I WALKED THERE TODAY, AND I DON'T REMEMBER SEEING ANY.
>> IF YOU GO TO THE EASTERN END, THAT'S WHERE WE HAVE A LOT OF RUNNING WHERE THE PAVEMENTS AND THAT AND CRACKING.
AT THE LEE CARLSON END, WE HAVE A LOT OF TRANSVERSE CRACKING, THAT WE'D DO SOME PATCHES AND THEN JUST TRY TO SEAL AND PRESERVE THE PAVEMENT LONGER.
THIS ROAD 61 IS, AGAIN, ONE WHERE WE'RE GOING TO WITH BOLTON & MENK, DO A LITTLE BIT MORE REFINEMENT ON THE DESIGN TO FIGURE OUT, EXACTLY WHAT TREATMENT DO WE USE IN EACH PIECE OF THIS? WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO TRY TO RE-PAVE THE ENTIRE THING THAT WOULD BE TOO COSTLY.
TRYING TO REALLY FOCUS IN ON WHAT WE CAN DO TO GET THAT PAVEMENT TO LAST AS LONG AS WE POSSIBLY CAN.
>> I HAD THE SAME QUESTION BECAUSE THIS TOP PICTURE DID NOT LOOK LIKE THE TRAIL THAT I SAW TODAY.
>> WE CAN BLAME THE LAST PARK, SUPERINTENDENT.
YOU PUT THOSE PICTURES TOGETHER.
>> THE ONES THAT I SAW WERE PARALLEL, NOT PERPENDICULAR, THE CRACKS OR THE DISRUPTIONS WERE NOT LIKE THIS
>> YOU'VE GOT LIKE IN THE PHOTO HERE, IF IT'S NOT THE RIGHT ONE, THAT'S THE SITUATION YOU HAVE DOWN AT THE EASTERN END AND DOWN AT THE WESTERN END, YOU HAVE MORE IT'S ACTUALLY, I THINK SLIGHTLY NEWER PAVEMENT.
>> THE EASTERN END IT HOLDS IN IN THE CENTER SO WHEN YOU'RE WALKING YOU CAN FEEL THAT IT'S SLOPING IN.
BUT AT THE BEGINNING ON THE WESTERN SIDE, IT'S ACROSS THAT.
>> IF YOU WALK THAT, IF YOU'RE AT THE LEE CARLSON END, YOU'RE UP ON HIGH GROUND, DOWN ON THE ROAD AS YOU GET TO THE OTHER END, YOU'RE LOOKING UP AT THE ROAD, SITTING BASICALLY IN SOME REALLY MUSHY STUFF.
>> I DID HAVE ONE QUESTION, THOUGH, WHEN I WAS WALKING IT, THERE IS THE LINE OF PINE TREES AND THEN BEHIND IT ARE ASH TREES THAT ARE ALL MARKED WITH A ORANGE RIBBON.
ARE THOSE MEANT FOR BEING REMOVED? THERE WERE ABOUT 11 OF THEM.
>> I WOULD IMAGINE, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT FOR SURE.
BUT DEPENDING ON THE LOCATION OF THOSE TREES, THAT WOULD BE A COUNTY RESPONSIBILITY IF IT'S WITHIN THE COUNTY RIGHT AWAY.
>> THE PINE TREES AREN'T MARKED, BUT THE ASH TREES BEHIND IT ARE ALL MARKED
>> COULD BE THE HOMEOWNERS AS WELL.
IT'S THAT PART WHEN YOU FIRST BEHIND THE BALL FIELDS.
THERE'S LIKE A SWAMP AREA THEY WERE BEHIND THERE.
THAT'S WHY I WAS QUESTIONING WHO MARKED THEM?
>> THOSE AREN'T OURS. WE DIDN'T MARK THEM ANYWAY.
>> I'M COMFORTABLE MAKING A MOTION ON THIS ONE.
>> MOTION TO APPROVE THE CR 6 TRAIL RESURFACING.
>> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
>> ALL THOSE OPPOSED SAME SIGN. MOTION CARRIES.
ANYBODY WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
>> I THINK WITH THE ANTOINE ONE, I LIKE TO TAKE A STEP BACK WITH THAT ONE AND WAIT TO SEE WHERE WE END UP IN HACKBERRY UNLESS ANYBODY FEELS LIKE THERE'S AN URGENCY TO WORK ON THAT PARK.
[01:15:05]
>> I WOULD NOTE THAT THE SCOPE OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE IS JUST TO DEVELOP A VISION TO REFRESH THE PARK FEATURES AND AMENITIES.
I DON'T THINK WE'RE COMMITTING TO ANY PARTICULAR DESIGN OR FEATURES
>> NO. THIS IS THAT VERY BEGINNING PLANNING LEVEL WORK TO ENGAGE WITH THE COMMUNITY AND FIND OUT WHAT THEIR DESIRES ARE AND THEN SEE HOW WE MIGHT DO THOSE THINGS.
>> IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S SOME IN PERSON PUBLIC MEETINGS AND WHATNOT.
>> IF YOU WERE NOT INCLINED TO SUPPORT HAVING CONSULTING SERVICES TO DO THIS OR ARE NOT READY TO PULL THE TRIGGER ON THIS YET, THEN THE ONE THING I WOULD SAY IS I WOULD LOOK TO MAYBE THE COUNCIL TO PROVIDE SOME GUIDANCE BACK TO THE PARKS COMMISSION ABOUT WHAT YOU'D LIKE TO SEE WITH RESPECT TO ANTOINE PARK, IF YOU LIKE THEM TO DO SOME THINGS OR STAFF TO DO SOME THINGS.
WE CAN'T DO A FULL MASTER PLAN.
STAFF DON'T HAVE THOSE SKILL SETS TO NECESSARILY DO SOME OF THOSE THINGS, BUT IF WE'RE NOT INCLINED TO SUPPORT THIS, THEN I THINK IF WE CAN GET SOME GUIDANCE OF WHAT YOU'D BE LOOKING FOR, WE'D AT LEAST LIKE TAKE THAT BACK.
>> BASED ON THAT, WHO BROUGHT THIS FORWARD THEN?
>> IT CAME FROM THE PARKS COMMISSION LAST YEAR, IT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THEY WERE LOOKING AT AND ASKED US TO INCLUDE IT IN THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN FOR THIS YEAR.
IT WENT THROUGH THEIR PROCESS LAST YEAR SO THAT WE CAN GET IT ON SCHEDULE THE NEXT THING THIS YEAR.
>> JUST TO BE CLEAR, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A $10,600 PROJECT HERE JUST TO HELP DESIGN.
>> CORRECT. JUST THE BEGINNING PROCESS TO HELP DESIGN GET NEIGHBORHOOD INPUT.
AGAIN, IT'S A START AND I THINK HELP PUT IN OVERALL TO HELP US REACH THOSE PARK STANDARDS WE WANT TO HAVE AND WHERE WE WANT TO GO BECAUSE WE'RE NOT COMMITTING TO ANYTHING OTHER THAN SAYING WE'RE GOING TO DO WHAT IT TAKES
>> I JUST KNOW WHAT OUR PARKS BUDGET HAS BEEN, SO IT'S HARD TO PART WITH MONEY WHEN WE DON'T HAVE A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF WHERE THAT'S GOING TO GO WITH SETTING EXPECTATIONS WITH RESIDENTS AND THAT THING.
ADAM, WHEN WAS THIS PARK LAST CONSIDERED AS A WHOLE REFRESH? ARE THERE ISSUES WE'RE TRYING TO FIX THERE, OR WE'RE TRYING TO BRING IT TO ADD THINGS? WHAT IN A NUTSHELL IS THE ISSUE HERE?
>> THAT PARK, I DON'T KNOW, AT LEAST IN MY TIME HERE, WE HAVEN'T DONE AN OVERARCHING STUDY OR MASTER PLAN FOR THE PARK.
WE'VE DONE A FEW MAINTENANCE LEVEL ACTIVITIES.
WE RE-DID, I THINK THE PLAYGROUND BORDERS AND THE PLAYGROUND FILL MATERIAL A FEW YEARS AGO.
WE'VE REPLACED THE SIGN, THE MAIN ENTRANCE SIGN FOR THE PARK A YEAR AGO, TWO YEARS AGO.
BEYOND THAT, IT'S BEEN MAINTENANCE WORK.
WE HAVE A NUMBER OF NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS.
THIS IS ONE OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS WHERE THE NEIGHBORHOOD CARES, AND THEY DO USE THIS PARK A LOT.
WE HAVE SUPPORTED THEM OVER THE YEARS, EVEN WITH BRINGING TABLES AND STUFF OUT THERE TO HELP THEM WITH THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD GET TOGETHER AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
WE DO HAVE SOME NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, JUST IN MY EXPERIENCE HERE THAT THEY'RE JUST THERE.
THE NEIGHBORHOOD REALLY DOESN'T EMBRACE THE MUCH THIS NEIGHBORHOOD DOES.
THEY HAD REACHED OUT TO JOE JUST THIS WEEK ASKING FOR MORE.
I'VE BEEN IN CONTACT WITH THEM AND THEY HAVE A GENERAL CONCERN OF WHAT'S GOING ON THERE.
I THINK IT'S A PARK THAT'S WELL USED AND COULD USE A LITTLE IMPROVEMENTS.
I THINK THE COMMUNITY THERE IS VERY VOCAL AND WOULD LET US KNOW WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR AND WHAT THEY NEED.
>> PLUS, WE HAVE YOUNGER FAMILIES MOVING IN THERE, TOO.
IT'S ONE OF THOSE THE OLDER OR MOVING OUT, THE YOUNGER MOVING IN WITH FAMILY BASED ON MY PAST EXPERIENCE IN THE LAST FEW WEEKS.
>> I GUESS I WOULD SAY BASED ON THAT, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THE ANTOINE DESIGN.
>> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
>> ALL THOSE OPPOSED SAME SIGN.
MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. GOOD DISCUSSION.
NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS THE MOUNTAIN BIKE PROPOSAL. MR. CARTER.
[10. Mountain Bike/Multiuse Trail]
[01:20:07]
>> MAYOR, COUNCIL MEMBERS, THANK YOU FOR TAKING THE TIME AND LISTENING TO ALL THE PUBLIC COMMENT.
I'M GOING TO TRY NOT TO REPEAT A LOT OF WHAT YOU HEARD AND MAYBE JUST PUT SOME GRAPHICS BEHIND IT.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL, MULTI USE TRAIL AT ORONO ORCHARDS.
I WANTED TO SAY BECAUSE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS A LOT.
OH, I'M SORRY, I SHOULD SAY I'M 2780, SHADYWOOD ROAD, ORONO, MINNESOTA, AND I'M ALSO A PARK COMMISSIONER ALTERNATE.
BUT OVER MY TIME, PROBABLY SEVEN OR EIGHT YEARS ON THE PARK COMMISSION, I WOULD SAY TWO PRIMARY WAYS THAT WE HANDLE PROJECTS.
ONE IS, WE DID A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN CHAPTER FOR THE 2030 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IN 2018, WHICH INCLUDED THE COUNTY ROAD TRAIL THAT'S BEING DONE TODAY, AS WELL AS MANY OTHER THINGS.
THE ORONO BIKE TEAM I THINK THE OR THE TEAM DIRECTOR BEFORE KELLY CAME, SO THAT HAD TO BE AT LEAST SIX YEARS AGO SAYING WE'RE PRACTICING BETWEEN FIELDS AT BEDERWOOD PARK AND WE STARTED TO LOOK FOR SOLUTIONS FOR THE KIDS.
THIS IS REALLY DIFFERENT, I'LL SHOW YOU A MAP OF SOME OF THE TRAILS WHERE I GO RIDE BECAUSE THIS IS REALLY ORIENTED AT THE YOUTH PRIMARILY WHO DON'T DRIVE.
NEXT SLIDE. I THINK THIS WAS REFERRED TO THIS IS THE THE MOUNTAIN BIKE DESERT THAT WE LIVE IN.
IF YOU'RE IN THE CENTER OF THAT CIRCLE OR OUT TO THE EDGES OF IT, IT TAKES 20, 25 MINUTES TO DRIVE, SO YOU HAVE TO HAVE A CAR WITH A RACK AND YOU HAVE TO DRIVE TO IT.
THEN WE'VE TALKED A LOT ABOUT ALTERNATIVE LOCATIONS, WE'VE LITERALLY BEEN LOOKING FOR A PLACE FOR THIS TO HAPPEN FOR FIVE OR SIX YEARS AND I REMEMBER ONE MEETING DISTINCTLY.
I KNOW ADAM WAS THERE AND BRIAN AND PROBABLY THE PREVIOUS COACH WHERE I SAID, WE'RE PUTTING THE ENTIRE MAP OF ORONO ON A SCREEN WE'RE GOING TO MAKE A LIST OF EVERY PLACE WE THINK WE COULD DO A MOUNTAIN BIKE PARK.
I DON'T CARE IF IT'S A PARK OWNED BY THE CITY PUBLIC OR PRIVATE, AND WE PROBABLY HAD A LIST OF 10 OR 15 PLACES.
THESE WERE THE TOP FOUR THAT WE'VE PROBABLY SPENT THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS ON, AND WE REALLY LOCKED IN PROBABLY ABOUT A YEAR AGO ON THE GOLF COURSE FOR A LOT OF THE REASONS THAT YOU'VE HEARD.
NEXT SLIDE. THIS IS THE GOLF COURSE, I THINK MOST PEOPLE ARE FAMILIAR WITH IT.
THERE'S NOT A LOT OF ROOM HERE.
THERE WAS ACTUALLY IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN FOR 2030, ONE OF THE INITIATIVES FOR THE GOLF COURSE WAS TO LOOK AT A PERIMETER TRAIL MAYBE IT WAS LURKING BACK THERE.
WE'VE GOT A LOT OF GOLF, AND WE'VE GOT SOME WETLANDS IN THE LOWER LEFT HAND CORNER, BUT YOU'LL SEE IN A MINUTE, THERE'S A PRETTY GOOD TREE COVERED HILLY AREA WHERE WE CAN CREATE A SMALL COURSE OUT OF THESE 45.2 ACRES.
NEXT SLIDE. I'M GOING TO DO A LITTLE BIT OF COMPARISON BECAUSE THERE ARE A COUPLE OF REALLY GOOD EXAMPLES IN THE METRO AREA OF SHARED USES BETWEEN GOLF COURSES AND MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS.
THIS IS THEATER WORTH PARK, WHERE I BIKED THIS MORNING.
IT'S IN THE CENTER OF THE CITY, IF I'M RIDING WITH MY FRIENDS FROM THE EAST SIDE THIS IS WHERE WE MEET.
THERE'S A NINE HOLE GOLF COURSE, A PAR 3, AND A FULL 18 COURSE.
I REMEMBER WHEN THIS FIRST STARTED, IT WASN'T OBVIOUS THAT GOLFERS AND BIKERS WERE GOING TO BE ABLE TO CO EXIST.
THERE WAS CONCERN ABOUT PARKING.
THERE WAS CONCERNED ABOUT USE OF THE FACILITY.
IN THIS CASE, IT WAS DEFINITELY A ONE PLUS ONE EQUALS THREE.
THEY HAVE A BRAND NEW FACILITY THERE THAT SERVES THE PAR 3 COURSE AND THE MOUNTAIN BIKES, AND THEY ISOLATED THE OLD [INAUDIBLE] TO BE ABLE TO USE FOR THE MAIN COURSE.
MOST OF THE TIME, YOU'RE UNAWARE, BUT I THOUGHT ABOUT THIS THE WHOLE TIME I WAS BIKING TODAY, EVEN THOUGH IT'S TOTALLY WOODED IN.
I CAN SEE GOLFERS MOST OF THE TIME I'M BIKING.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THEY CAN NECESSARILY SEE ME, BUT WE'RE REALLY NOT BOTHERING EACH OTHER. NEXT SLIDE.
>> SO THIS IS THE PART OF THE ORONO ORCHARD THAT WE CAN REALLY TAKE ADVANTAGE OF.
I WANT TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT SOME OF THE THINGS YOU HEARD ABOUT WHY THIS IS IDEAL.
SOME OF IT IS LOCATION, SOME OF IT IS DISTANCE, SOME OF IT IS JUST THE TERRAIN WE HAVE, WHICH ISN'T TOO HILLY, BUT IT GIVES YOU ENOUGH HILL TO DO SOME SINGLE TRACK.
NEXT SLIDE. THEN ANOTHER COMPARISON.
I'M NOT GOING TO GUARANTEE THESE ARE THE EXACT SCALE, BUT IF YOU BEAR WITH ME, THE SLIDE ON THE LEFT IS THE PART OF ORONO ORCHARD.
THE SLIDE ON THE RIGHT IS A PORTION OF THEATER WORTH PARK, AND IT'S THE ONLY PORTION.
ACTUALLY, I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF YOU CAN SEE IT.
THERE'S A SMALL PORTION OF THE TRAIL WITHIN THE WHITE LINES THAT'S GREEN,
[01:25:03]
WHICH IS THE TRAIL THAT THESE KIDS NEED.OUR TRAIL WILL BE ALL GREEN, AND WE'RE PROBABLY SITTING CLOSER TO 1.5 OR 1.7 MILES.
I JUST DID A QUICK SURVEY BECAUSE WE HAVE APPS THAT TELL US THIS.
ALL THOSE TRAILS THAT SURROUND US THAT YOU CAN DRIVE 25 MILES TO GET TO, THE LONGEST GREEN TRAIL IS 1.5 MILES AND THAT'S BRAEMAR, THE NEW ONE.
I WAS COACHING KIDS THERE ON SATURDAYS THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS, SO TO BE ABLE TO TAKE A SIX SEVEN EIGHT-YEAR-OLD WHO'S NEW ON A BIKE ON A SINGLE TRACK, A HALF-MILE LOOP THAT I COULD GO AROUND.
STILL WAS BETTER THAN NOTHING, BUT IT'S LIMITING.
ACTUALLY, I WAS ABLE TO GO RIDE, AND WE HELD A MEETING THAT WAS VIRTUAL THAT INCLUDED OUR MAYOR, OUR PARK STAFF, THE EDINA MAYOR, AND THEIR PARK STAFF.
GRANTED, THIS IS A WHOLE DIFFERENT BALL GAME.
THEY HAVE LIKE A $75 MILLION BOND TO DO PARKS.
BUT THEY FOUND A WAY TO TAKE AN EXISTING GOLF COURSE AND USE THE PERIMETER TO CREATE TRAILS.
AND AGAIN, IF YOU LOOK CLOSE ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE BETWEEN THE BLUE AND THE YELLOW.
THE YELLOW IS WALKING, THE BLUE IS MORE ADVANCED TRAILS.
THERE'S ABOUT 1.5 MILE OF JUST AMAZING, GOOD GREEN TRAIL.
ONE OF THE THINGS THE MAYOR SAID THEY'RE REALLY STUCK TO ME IS THEIR COACH MAKES THE KIDS BIKE TO PRACTICE, AND THEY FEEL SAFE BEING ABLE TO DO THAT BEFORE THEY WERE BIKING THROUGH DINA, THROUGH ST. LOUIS PARK, INTO MINNEAPOLIS TO GET TO THEATER WORTH PARK.
NEXT. WE WILL HAVE, AND THIS IS UNIQUE.
MOST OF THE TRAILS DON'T HAVE THIS.
WHEN I GET TO THE SLIDE THAT SHOWS THE TRAIL, THERE'S A YELLOW POLYGON THAT'S AN AREA WHERE WE WOULD CREATE A SKILLS COURSE.
IT'S A PLACE WHERE KIDS CAN PRACTICE THE THINGS THAT THEY WOULD SEE ON A COURSE WHEN THEY GOT TO THE BLUE TRAILS, HOPEFULLY WHEN THEY GET A LITTLE BIT OLDER. THAT WOULD BE GREAT.
AGAIN, WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE A DESTINATION.
THIS IS A PLACE FOR THE LOCAL TEAMS TO COME AND PRACTICE.
SOME PEOPLE ARTS CRAZY ABOUT BIKING IN THE WINTER, BUT THERE IS A PRETTY STRONG CONTINGENT OF FAT BIKING.
IT'S A GREAT PLACE TO HIKE AND TO SNOWSHOE, IT'S ACTUALLY A GOOD COMBINATION, THE SNOWSHOES PACKET DOWN, WHICH IS REALLY GOOD FOR THE BIKERS, SO I SEE THAT BEING A POTENTIAL AS WELL.
NEXT. THIS IS THE SLIDE THAT SHOWS THE TRAIL, AND THIS WHOLE CONVERSATION ABOUT MASTER PLAN AND DESIGN.
THIS IS JUST WORK THAT WE'VE DONE AT NO COST.
BASICALLY, BETWEEN THE BIKE COACHES AND MYSELF, A TRAIL DESIGNER, WE WALKED THE PLACE AND FIGURED OUT LIKE ADAM SAID, THE WORLD OF POSSIBILITIES.
WE THINK THIS IS PRETTY CLOSE.
THE TRAIL ITSELF, I THINK IS PROBABLY GOING TO STAY PRETTY MUCH LOOKING LIKE THAT WITH THE SKILLS TRACK.
WE HAVE A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT WAYS THAT WE COULD GET FROM THE LOOSE LINE.
BUT JUST LIKE, I THINK THE COACH FROM IZETA TALKED ABOUT FROM GLEASON, WE WOULD PROBABLY STILL HAVE THE MOUNTAIN BIKE TEAM BASE AT BEDERWOOD PARK, SO THEY CAN BE DROPPED OFF OR THEY CAN BIKE THERE.
THEY BIKE A COUPLE OF MILES DOWN HERE.
THEY DROP INTO THE TRAIL, DO A COUPLE OF LAPS, AND GO BACK, AND IT'S A GREAT EIGHT OR NINE-MILE RIDE FOR THEM, AND THEY GET TO DO SOME REAL SINGLE TRACK, WHICH OTHERWISE, THEY CAN'T DO WITHOUT GETTING IN A CAR.
NEXT. I THINK YOU CAN MAKE WAY UP HERE, BRIAN.
I'M NOT GOING TO GO THROUGH THIS.
I'M JUST GOING TO SAY THAT WE HAVE REALLY THOUGHT A LOT ABOUT THIS BECAUSE WE'VE SPENT A LOT OF TIME ON IT.
WE'RE AT NUMBER SEVEN, WHICH IS WHAT WE HOPE THAT YOU WOULD DO, WHICH IS TO APPROVE FROM THE CIP UP TO $15,000.
IT WON'T BE BOLTON AND MENK BECAUSE THEY DON'T DESIGN MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS, WHO WILL BE ABLE TO GIVE US A FINAL DESIGN, DO SOME ENGAGEMENT WITH THE MOUNTAIN BIKE COMMUNITY, THE GOLF COURSE COMMUNITY, THE NEIGHBORS, AND BE ABLE TO CREATE A PLAN THAT WE KNOW HOW MUCH IT WILL COST.
WE KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY WE HAVE TO GO GET.
THAT WOULD THEN GO BACK TO THE PARKS COMMISSION BEFORE IT COMES BACK TO YOU FOR A RECOMMENDATION TO PROCEED.
I THINK I'M NOT GOING TO GUESS AT DOLLAR AMOUNTS, BUT I WOULD THINK THE MAJORITY OF THE MONEY COULD BE RAISED THROUGH PRIVATE AND THROUGH GRANTS.
I'M NOT GOING TO SAY WE WOULDN'T ASK FOR MORE MONEY.
THAT'S POSSIBLE, BUT RIGHT NOW WE NEED 15,000 TO GET IT TO THE NEXT STEP.
I'M GOING TO HAVE BRIAN, WHO'S OUR CHAIR COME UP.
I'LL STAY FOR QUESTIONS TO THE NEXT SLIDE.
PLEASE STAY HERE FOR A COUPLE OF POINTS.
>> THANKS, RICK. FIRST I WANT TO THANK YOU RICK FOR ALL THE TIME AND THE EFFORT YOU SPENT OVER THE LAST FIVE, OR SEVEN YEARS.
I JUST WANTED TO PROVIDE SOME PERSPECTIVE FROM THE PARK COMMISSION HERE,
[01:30:01]
SO ADD SOME COLOR.AGAIN, REPEATING SOME STUFF THAT RICK HAD SAID, THIS HAD STARTED AS A REQUEST FROM THE COMMUNITY, THESE PASSIONATE PEOPLE WHO APPROACHED RICK AND THE COMMISSION A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO AND AFTER YEARS OF LOOKING FOR A GOOD LOCATION, I THINK IN THE LAST YEAR OR TWO, WE FINALLY CREATED A SUBCOMMITTEE AT THE PARK COMMISSION TO FOCUS ON SEEING IF THIS LOCATION HERE WAS A VIABLE OPTION.
AT THE END OF LAST YEAR, THROUGH THE CIP PROCESS, WE COMMUNICATED WITH THE COUNCIL AT THE TIME, THROUGH THE CIP PROCESS THAT THIS MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT COULD HAPPEN IN 2025.
THE PARK COMMISSION TOOK THIS UP AT THE BEGINNING OF 2025 AND VOTED UNANIMOUSLY TO MOVE THIS FORWARD.
NOW, I'M GLAD THAT WE HAD THE DISCUSSION EARLIER ABOUT HACKBERRY AND SOME OF THE OTHER PARKS BECAUSE THIS IS EXACTLY WHERE WE ARE SIMILAR TO HACKBERRY, WHICH IS, WE DON'T HAVE A DESIGN.
WE HAVE A CONCEPT, WHICH IS WHAT RICK PUT TOGETHER.
I THINK THE REQUEST TONIGHT AND THE RECOMMENDATION FROM THE PARKS COMMISSION IS THAT WE MOVE FORWARD TO DESIGN.
IN DESIGN IS WHERE WE WOULD ANSWER A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS AND THE CONCERNS THAT ARE STILL OUT THERE AND UNANSWERED.
THE PARK COMMISSION STILL HAS CONCERNS AND QUESTIONS THAT ARE THAT HAVE NOT BEEN ANSWERED.
SOME OF THE CONCERNS INCLUDE ACCESS.
THERE'S A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT WAYS TO ACCESS THIS FROM THE LOOSE LINE.
HOW DO WE DO THINGS LIKE MAKE SURE THAT THE TRAIL IS NOT OVERWHELMED BY BIKERS? HOW DO WE PLAN FOR PARKING, THOSE TYPES OF THINGS? THROUGH THE DESIGN THE PROPOSED DESIGN PROCESS IS WHERE SIMILAR TO HACKBERRY, WE'LL HAVE OPEN HOUSES.
WE'LL HAVE MORE COMMUNITY INPUT, AND WE'LL BE ABLE TO COME BACK TO BOTH THE PARK COMMISSION.
THEN POSSIBLY BACK TO YOU TO ASK IF IT MAKES SENSE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS.
THAT'S WHERE WE ARE TONIGHT AND I THINK THAT WAS IT.
I JUST WANTED TO IF YOU GUYS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, WE CAN OPEN IT UP TO QUESTIONS.
>> QUESTIONS FROM THE COUNSEL?
>> IF I GO BACK TO THE QUESTION.
>> AS YOU DESIGN THAT MAP THERE AND THAT AS I'M LOOKING AT A LOWER LEFT CORNER THERE.
>> THE WHITE LINE IS THE PROPERTY LINE.
>> WHITE LINE IS THE PROPERTY LINE?
>> THE RED LINE WOULD BE THE TRAIL.
>> ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THIS?
>> THAT'S WHITE LINE. BUT IT IS CITY PROPERTY.
THERE ARE PETTY COST STRUCTURES.
WE SET BACK FROM THE WHITE LINE.
>> NO, WOULD THERE BE ANY CHANGES THAT YOU SEE BASED WHAT WOULD HAVE TO DO TO THE GOLF COURSE?
>> TO GET INTO THE WEEDS, THE ONE ACCESS THAT STONE HAS A POTENTIAL UP AND DOWN THE WEST PROPERTY LINE.
RIGHT NOW, THERE ARE TWO GREENS THAT ARE CLOSE TO THAT LINE AND ONE T BOX THAT ACTUALLY CROSSES THE LINE INTO THE NEIGHBOR'S PROPERTY.
IF WE KEPT THAT ACCESS, WE WOULD NEED TO MOVE THAT T BOX INTO THE GOLF COURSE.
THEN WE PROVIDE SCREENING FOR THAT T BOX AND TWO GREEN.
BUT WE'VE GOT OTHER WAYS THAT WE CAN GO ON TO.
WE LOOK AT THREE DIFFERENT WAYS HERE [INAUDIBLE].
>> PLEASE TALK ON THE MICROPHONE THERE.
>> THANKS, JANNY. DID I ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?
>> I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND THE TRAIL.
THE TRAIL BASICALLY RUNS AROUND THE ENTIRE GOLF, OF COURSE.
IT RUNS BEHIND THE NUMBER ONE GREEN.
[01:35:02]
IT RUNS OVER TO THE NUMBER NINE FAIRWAY.IT RUNS ALL THE WAY UP NUMBER TWO.
SOMEHOW, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A TRACK TO THE CLUBHOUSE, BUT IT ALSO GOES TO THE RIGHT SIDE OF NUMBER THREE, ALL THE WAY DOWN ORCHARD PARK ROAD INTO AN AREA THAT IS TYPICALLY WET ALONG NUMBER FOUR, CONTINUES TO GO DOWN NORTH ORCHARD PARK ROAD, I THINK IT'S CALLED, AND IT COMES UP THE HILL BEHIND NUMBER SIX, NUMBER SEVEN GREEN AND THEN GOES BACK BEHIND THE REST OF THE COURSE.
>> YOU KNOW THE NUMBERS BETTER THAN I DO.
WHAT I WOULD SAY IS THAT THE TRAIL THAT YOU SEE THAT'S THE DIAGONAL PIECE ALONG THE WETLANDS, THAT'S THE TRAIL.
ALL THE OTHER RED LINE ARE TWO OR THREE DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET FROM THE LOOSE LINE TO THAT TRAIL.
WE WOULD DO ONE OF THEM. DOES THAT HELP?
>> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. WE DON'T KNOW.
WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S POSSIBLE.
WE HAVE A FIRST STAB AT WHAT MIGHT BE POSSIBLE.
DEPENDING ON THROUGH THE DESIGN PROCESS, WE WILL FIGURE OUT IF THERE IS A WAY TO ACCESS IT FROM THE SOUTH, ACCESS IT FROM NORTH, HAVE AN ACCESS TRAIL THAT GOES ALONG THE ROAD TO THE PARKING LOT, AND SO FORTH.
>> THE ONE THING I WOULD ADD IS, WHEN WE FIRST TALKED ABOUT THIS, WE TALKED ABOUT POTENTIALLY ONLY HAVING ACCESS FROM THE PARKING LOT.
IN OTHER WORDS, YOU'D HAVE TO BIKE OR DRIVE TO THE PARKING LOT.
MOST OF THE FEEDBACK WE GOT WAS THERE SHOULD BE A WAY TO GET FROM THE LOOSE LINE.
WE KNOW THERE'S COMPROMISES COMING DOWN THE WEST SIDE.
I THINK THERE'S PROBABLY LESS COMPROMISES COMING AROUND THE EAST SIDE, BUT WE COULD ALSO GO ALONG THE ROAD.
I DIDN'T SHOW YOU ON THE BRAEMAR, BUT THE TWO CHUNKS OF THE BRAEMAR TRAIL ARE CONNECTED BY A ROAD THAT'S ABOUT THAT LENGTH THAT JUST HAS A BIKE TRAIL MARKED ON THE ROAD.
THAT'S A POSSIBILITY, AS WELL.
>> WHEN YOU SPOKE ABOUT, I'M SORRY, STEVE?
>> NO. I WAS JUST GOING TO ASK. I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY THE AREA ALONG NUMBER FOUR, WHERE IT SAYS ALTERNATIVE PATH TO THE LOOSE LINE.
>> THAT'S THE TRAIL, MOUNTAIN BIKE AREA.
>> IT WOULD BE A PATH IF WE FIND THAT THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO GET THERE, AND THAT'S THE BEST WAY TO GO.
OTHERWISE, IT WOULDN'T BE THERE.
>> IT COULD BE WITHIN THE RIGHT AWAY PRACTICALLY.
IT'S SHOWN TO BE VERY CLOSE TO THE ROAD ON THE LOWER HALF, AND THEN WE GO INBOARD UP ABOVE.
THAT'S WHERE WE JUST NEED A DESIGNER.
>> I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. I PLAYED THAT COURSE 2000 TIMES AND THERE'S THERE'S 15 FEET BEHIND THE NUMBER FIVE GREEN IN THE ROAD.
>> MAYBE BEING ON THE ROAD WOULD BE THE SOLUTION THERE.
>> YOU HAD MADE A COMMENT THAT AT THEATER, WHEN YOU RIDE THERE, YOU CAN SEE THE GOLFERS, BUT THEY CAN'T SEE YOU.
>> OH, I SAID, I'M NOT SURE WHAT THEY CAN SEE OF ME.
>> IN HERE, EVERYBODY'S GOING TO BE ABLE TO SEE YOU.
>> I WOULD SAY BECAUSE I'VE WALKED THE AREA WHERE THE TRAIL IS.
WHEN YOU'RE BIKING THAT LOOP, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE VISIBLE FROM THE GOLF COURSE.
IF WE DROP DOWN ON THE EAST SIDE, DEPENDING ON SCREENING, YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO SEE BIKES COMING FROM THE LOOSE LINE, BUT IT WOULD REALLY JUST BE TO GET FROM POINT A TO POINT B.
SOME PLACES, YES, SOME PLACES NOT.
>> WHAT'S BEEN THE REACTION SO FAR FROM THE GOLFING COMMUNITY? SUPPORTIVE, POSITIVE, NEGATIVE.
I GUESS ONE OF THE CONCERNS IS WE'VE GOT A BEAUTIFUL GOLF COURSE.
DO WE SOMEHOW SPOIL THE EXPERIENCE OF THE GOLFERS BY HAVING A MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL SURROUNDING IT?
>> EXACTLY. AND THAT'S THE CONCERN.
STEVE, I KNOW, HAS BEEN THERE SINCE MOST OF HIS LIFE.
HE DOESN'T WANT TO SEE BIKERS THERE EITHER.
BUT THIS IS MAYBE A COMPROMISE WHERE WE CAN USE ONE OF OUR PARKS.
MOST OF THE AREA, MOST OF THE RED, AS YOU CAN SEE, IS AN UNUSED PART OF THE PARK THAT IS NOT VISIBLE TO GOLFERS OR DOESN'T IMPEDE GOLFERS.
THERE ARE A COUPLE OF PINCH POINTS DEPENDING ON HOW WE ACCESS IT.
THERE ARE A COUPLE OF PINCH POINTS THAT COULD BE VISIBLE TO GOLFERS, SO FORTH.
>> I WALKED BACK THERE WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO PUT THE TRAILS.
THERE ARE A LOT OF DEAD TREES BACK THERE,
[01:40:02]
AND THERE ARE A LOT OF HUGE TREES THAT ARE DEAD AND FALLEN.THIS IS NOT AN EASY PLACE WITHOUT A LOT OF WORK ON MOVING A LOT OF MAJOR TREES FOR YOU TO BE ABLE TO RIDE A BIKE THROUGH THERE.
>> I WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT WE WILL HAVE POSITIVE OUTCOMES THAT THE GOLFERS WOULD SAY, WELL, I'M REALLY GLAD THAT HAPPENED.
WE'D BE ABLE TO CLEAR BUCKTHORN, WE'D BE ABLE TO SOLVE THE PROPERTY LINE ISSUE.
WE'D BE ABLE TO ADD SOME SCREENING, GET RID OF SOME OF THE DEAD TREES.
WE WOULD HAVE TO GET THEM OUT OF THE WAY IF THEY'RE LAYING ACROSS AN AREA.
I WOULD THINK THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'D BE ABLE TO COME BACK AND SAY, THIS IS A PLUS.
IT'S ALSO MAKING THIS GOLF COURSE STRONGER SO THAT IT STAYS A GOLF COURSE FOR ANOTHER HUNDRED YEARS.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT THEY'VE BEEN SEEING HAPPEN AT PLACES LIKE WORTH AND BRAEMAR THAT IT'S PEN ONE PLUS ONE EQUALS THREE, NOT THAT THEY'RE REGRETTING HAVING DONE IT.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE COMMUNITY WHO PLANS TO USE THIS BECAUSE I KNOW WE HEARD SOME REALLY NICE COMMENTS TONIGHT FROM, I THINK, FIVE DIFFERENT CITIES OUTSIDE ORONO OR FIVE OR SIX.
CAN YOU TALK ABOUT WHO WILL BE USING THIS ASSET?
>> IT WOULD BE PRIMARILY THE ORONO TEAM.
I THINK A LOT OF THOSE PEOPLE LIVE IN THE DIFFERENT COMMUNITIES AROUND HERE.
THE IZETA TEAM WOULD BE INTERESTED AS LONG AS IT'S NOT TOO MUCH.
WE SAID, THE FIRST THINGS FIRST, IS THERE A LEAGUE NIGHT? WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE PRACTICES THEN.
THAT'S WHAT THEY DO AT BRAEMAR AS WELL.
THEY COORDINATE WITH THE PRIMARY USERS, AND I WOULD CALL THE GOLFERS THE PRIMARY USERS.
THEN THEY COORDINATE AMONGST THEMSELVES SO THAT IT WOULD JUST BE PROBABLY THOSE TWO TEAMS, IZETA AND ORONO COORDINATING.
>> WHEN YOU SAY ORONO, IS THAT A COMMUNITY ED TEAM, OR IS THAT AN ORONO SCHOOLS TEAM?
>> YOU SAID YOU HAD FOUR THAT WERE YOUR TOP PICKS.
WHY DID THIS ONE COME UP RATHER THAN SAY THE PIECE OF LAND THAT WAS ADJACENT TO THE LOOSE LAND OWNED BY THE DNR?
>> NO, THAT WAS A STRONG CANDIDATE.
THE DNR HAS ONLY ONE PROPERTY IN THE STATE OF MINNESOTA WITH MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS ON, AND IT'S CALLED CUYUNA, WHICH IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAILS IN THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.
THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN THEIR SECOND.
WE HUNG IN THERE FOR A WHILE WITH THEM.
AT THE END OF THE DAY, THERE WAS JUST TOO MUCH WETLAND THERE.
IT'S DOMINATED BY WETLAND, AND THEY COULDN'T SEE CLEAR TO MAKE IT WORK, SO THEY ELIMINATED IT FROM CONSIDERATION.
>> HOW FAR IS THE TRAIL FROM THE WETLAND HERE? I DIDN'T HEAR THAT EARLIER. DID YOU SAY 20 OR 200 FEET?
>> TWENTY FEET IS THE BUFFER WE'RE KEEPING.
THAT'S THE BLUE LINE AND THE GREEN LINE ALONG THE EDGE OF THE WETLAND.
>> JUST TO BE CLEAR, THERE'S BEEN NO VETTING WITH OUR STAFF ABOUT ANY OF THESE PROPOSED.
HAS STAFF BEEN INVOLVED IN ANY OF THE VETTING PROCESS FOR THESE PROPOSED TRAILS WITH REGARD TO THE WETLAND OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT?
>> WE'VE WORKED WITH THE PARKS COMMISSION AND RICK AND HIS TEAM ON IDENTIFYING POTENTIAL AREAS.
WE'VE ALSO, I WOULD SAY, FAMILIARIZED THE CONCEPT WITH THE COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT STAFF, BUT IT IS NOT AT A POINT YET WHERE WE HAVE SOMETHING FOR THEM TO ACTIVELY REVIEW.
LAURA PUT TOGETHER A LIST OF ITEMS THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO REVIEW AS WE LOOKED AT ANY POTENTIAL DESIGN FOR THAT SITE TO ENSURE THAT WE WERE MEETING WETLAND SETBACKS AND ALL THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO DO ON ANY PROJECT LIKE THAT ON THIS PARCEL OF LAND.
>> WE'VE ALSO ENGAGED WITH THE GOLF COURSE MANAGER.
GREG AND KIM. GREG CAME OUT AND WALKED THE SITE WITH US MAYBE A MONTH AGO OR WHATEVER, AND KIM'S BEEN INVOLVED IN THIS AS WELL.
>> WAS HE SUPPORTIVE GENERALLY?
>> HE WAS INTERESTED IN SEEING SOME THINGS IMPROVED.
WE TALKED ABOUT SOME OF THE THINGS ON THEIR WISH LIST LIKE A FIRING.
WELL, THAT WOULD BE GOOD FOR BOTH PARTIES.
MAYBE WE CAN DO THE FIRING AS PART OF OUR PROJECT, SO I WOULD SAY IT WAS VERY RECEPTIVE.
>> DO WE HAVE ANY BALLPARK IDEA OF THE TOTAL COST OF WHAT IS SKETCHED OUT HERE?
>> I'M AN ARCHITECT BY PROFESSION, SO THAT'S A VERY DANGEROUS QUESTION TO ASK, BUT I WILL GO.
GIVEN THE ORDER OF MAGNITUDE OF WHAT THEY DID AT BRAEMAR,
[01:45:03]
AND THEY THREADED THE NEEDLE WITH TIMING, AND WE COULD DO THAT, TOO, I WOULD SAY, PROBABLY IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OF ABOUT 100,000.WELL, WE'D HOPE TO BE ABLE TO DO MOST OF THAT, IF NOT ALL OF IT WITH GRANTS AND PRIVATE FUNDING.
I THINK WE'D COME BACK IF WE HAD TO TO PLUG A GAP OR GET A MATCH.
COULD BE MORE. THAT'S A GUESS.
THAT'S REALLY MY MAIN POINT IS, JUST LIKE THOSE OTHER DISCUSSIONS, ALL WE'RE ASKING FOR IS TO GET AND IT'S JUST SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT WITH A BIKE TRAIL.
FINAL DESIGN DOESN'T HAPPEN UNTIL THEY WALK AWAY WITH THE SHOVELS AND THE BACKHOES, BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BE ABLE.
THEY'RE NOT GOING TO TAKE OUT TREES UNLESS THEY ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO.
THEY'RE REALLY DOING A LOT OF IT WHILE THEY'RE OUT THERE.
BUT WE WOULD HAVE A PRETTY CONCISE LAYOUT.
WE WOULD KNOW WHICH ACCESS POINT WE WERE GOING TO USE.
WE WOULD KNOW HOW MUCH IT WAS GOING TO COST.
WE WOULD HAVE THE FEEDBACK FROM THE GOLF COMMUNITY AND THE NEIGHBORS.
IF IT ALL STILL MAKES SENSE, THEN IT WOULD COME BACK HERE WITH A RECOMMENDATION FROM THE PARKS COMMISSION.
>> I GUESS AS FAR AS TREES AND STUFF, I'M A LITTLE CONCERN BECAUSE WE HAVE A LOT OF DEAD ASH BACK THERE, TOO, BESIDES ALL THE OTHER ONES THAT ARE TOPPLED OVER.
I'M JUST THINKING WITH OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND STUFF.
IF WE FALL A TREE, WE'D LIKE TO PLANT TWO MORE.
I'M WRESTLING WITH WHAT'S THAT GOING TO LOOK LIKE WITH YOUNG TREES IN THERE? YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO CLEAN OUT A LOT.
I KNOW THE GOLF COURSE LOOKED LIKE THEY HAD A GIANT COMPOST PILE BACK THERE AS WELL, PRETTY CLOSE TO WHERE YOU GUYS ARE WANTING TO SET UP YOUR SKILLS AREA.
I GUESS HAVE TO SEE WHAT SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE BECAUSE THERE'S A LOT GOING ON THERE THAT JUST, MAKING SOME RED LINES ON THE MAP.
>> THEY WOULD HAVE TO DO A TREE INVENTORY IN THE AREA WHERE THE TRAIL IS GOING TO GO.
AGAIN, WE'D HAVE A MUCH BETTER HANDLE ON THAT IF WE WERE ABLE TO DO THIS STEP.
>> ONE OF THE CONCERNS I HAVE AS I LOOK AT THIS, UP TOWARDS THE TOP OR JUST UNDER THE WORD, BEDERWOOD.
THE RED LINE IS LITERALLY RUNNING DOWN THE FAIRWAY OF NUMBER 6.
THEN YOU GO BEHIND THE TREES AND YOU'RE LITERALLY RUNNING ON THE GREEN OR JUST THEREABOUTS BEHIND THE SIXTH GREEN AND YOU'RE RUNNING IN FRONT OF THE SEVENTH TEE BOX.
IT'S HARD FOR ME TO GET MY ARMS AROUND HOW THAT WOULD BE SAFE.
>> THERE IS A POTENTIAL THAT THAT SIDE COULD ACCESS IN THAT UPPER CORNER.
IT'S THE PLACE WHERE TWO PRIVATE PROPERTIES AND TWO PUBLIC PROPERTIES MEET.
THAT WE'RE TRYING TO BE VERY CONSERVATIVE HERE AND SAY WE DON'T KNOW IF THAT CAN HAPPEN.
IF IT COULD, THEN WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO DROP DOWN AND COME AROUND.
OR, AGAIN, IF WE CAN TAKE THE EASTERLY ROUTE OR JUST SAY WE'RE GOING TO GO ON THE ROAD, THOSE ARE ALL OPTIONS.
THAT'S AGAIN, WHAT WE WOULD VET WITH THIS PROCESS.
>> NOW, I SEE THIS AS A WONDERFUL RESOURCE FOR THE BEGINNER BIKER, THE, 10, 12-YEAR-OLD.
>> OR EVEN YOUNGER. IS THIS GOING TO BE A RESOURCE THAT IS VALUED BY MEMBERS OF THE HIGH SCHOOL TEAM THAT PRESUMABLY ARE GOING TO WANT A BETTER CHALLENGE THAN A GREEN TRAIL?
>> THEY'RE NOT GOING TO COME HERE UNLESS THEY'VE GOT A YOUNGER BROTHER OR SISTER THAT THEY WANT TO RIDE WITH.
>> THIS IS REALLY FOR THE BEGINNER BIKER.
>> I WOULD SAY BETWEEN THE AGES OF SIX AND 15.
>> IS THAT THE SAME AGE THAT'S RIDING AT BEDERWOOD NOW? THE ISSUE THERE IS THAT IT'S NOT SUFFICIENT.
>> IT'S JUST WATCH WHAT YOU WISH FOR.
THE MORE WE DEVELOPED THAT WE'VE ADDED THE PARKING LOT AND THE PLAYGROUNDS AND THE BALL FIELDS, AND I MEAN, I BIKE THERE WITH THEM.
THEY'RE TYPE ROPING THROUGH FIELDS AND ON THE EDGE OF THE WOODS, AND IT'S JUST NOT A SUSTAINABLE SOLUTION FOR THEM.
>> WHY DO THEY HAVE TO HAVE A SINGLE TRACK VERSUS RIDING THE LOOSE LINE AND STUFF FOR TRYING TO GET READY FOR COMPETITIONS?
>> I DON'T KNOW HOW TO EQUATE IT TO A DIFFERENT SPORT, BUT THAT'S THE VENUE THAT THE RACES ARE ON IS THE SINGLE TRACK.
WHEREAS THE LOOSE LINE IS A FLAT PAVED TRAIL.
>> THIS WOULD STRICTLY BE FOR TRAINING, RIGHT? BECAUSE IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A COMPETITION,
[01:50:02]
ARE THOSE COMPETITIONS TAKING PLACE?>> IT WOULDN'T BE BIG ENOUGH FOR A COMPETITION.
>> NO. WHERE ARE THE COMPETITIONS TAKING PLACE?
>> THEY HAVE THEM AT LAKE REBECCA.
NOT EVERY PLACE, BUT, AND AGAIN, IT'S AGE GROUP DEPENDENT.
I THINK THE STATE MEET IS AT GIANTS RIDGE.
>> DO YOU HAVE AN IDEA OF HOW MANY OTHER COUNCILS OR CITIES IN THE AREA HAVE ENTERTAINED A CONCEPT PLAN LIKE THIS?
>> I'D SAY WE HAVE PRETTY GOOD TABS ON THE DEVELOPMENT.
THE ONLY PLACE THAT WE THOUGHT OUTSIDE OF OUR CONTROL WOULD BE A GOOD ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE BAKER, BUT THREE RIVERS IS SAYING WE'VE DONE OUR SINGLE TRACK TRAILS.
WE'VE GOT THEM. WE'RE NOT DOING ONE AT BAKER, SO I DON'T KNOW OF THAT ARE BEING DEVELOPED.
>> BAKER WOULD BE IDEAL FOR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
>> IT WOULD BE PROBABLY BETTER FOR A BIGGER ONE, BUT THEY HAVE NO PLAN. NOT THAT I KNOW OF.
>> NO OTHER CITIES LIKE MINNESOTA, WE HEARD FROM SOME OTHER FOLKS HERE TONIGHT, MINNESOTA PLYMOUTH.
NO OTHER CITIES ARE ENTERTAINING THIS.
>> NOT THAT I KNOW OF. THEY POP UP, LIKE E DANA I WASN'T AWARE OF UNTIL I SAW IT SHOW UP ON MY APPS.
YOU'VE ASKED A COUPLE OF TIMES ABOUT UP A SIX FAIRWAY.
THE WAY THAT IT'S WRITTEN HERE, IT'S NOT INTENDED TO BE A LOOP.
THE TRAIL IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A LOOP.
THOSE ARE ALONG SIX AND ALONG THE ROAD, THOSE ARE ACCESS POINTS TO GET TO THE MAIN AREA HERE.
IT'S NOT INTENDED TO GO THROUGH THE WOODS AREA AND THEN GO AROUND THE WHOLE THING AND COME BACK TO THE WOODS AREA.
IF THROUGH DESIGN, WE MAY RULE OUT ONE OR TWO OF THOSE ACCESS AREAS, IN WHICH CASE, THEN YOU EITHER COME DOWN THE ROAD OR YOU GO THE OTHER WAY.
>> WHAT ABOUT THE MAINTENANCE OF THIS OVER TIME? HOW IS THAT HANDLED?
>> THE WAY IT WORKS ROUGHLY, I THINK OUR MORC REPRESENTATIVE HAD TO LEAVE.
BUT THE MINNESOTA OFF ROAD CYCLING GROUP, THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE HERE.
THEY BASICALLY ORGANIZED VOLUNTEER TEAMS. WE WANT THEIR BLESSING SO THAT THEY'LL PUT THE REPORTS ON THE APP SO THE COACH CAN GO ON TWO HOURS BEFORE, BECAUSE IF IT'S RAINY AND MUDDY, THEY CAN'T RIDE.
IN ORDER TO GET THAT, WE HAVE TO HAVE AN ORGANIZED GROUP OF VOLUNTEERS WHO AGREE TO TAKE CARE OF THE TRAIL.
IT'S COMPLETELY THE FOLKS BEHIND ME TAKING CARE OF THE TRAIL.
>> ARE THOSE FOLKS INVOLVED AT BEDERWOOD CURRENTLY? OR NO?
>> THE PEOPLE WHO ARE ON THE ORONO TEAM.
>> ORGANIZE VOLUNTEERS OR GROUPS OF VOLUNTEERS WHO MAINTAIN THINGS.
>> THERE'S NO SINGLE TRAP THERE.
THEY'RE JUST RIDING ON THE GRASS.
>> HAVE THERE BEEN ANY ISSUES AT BEDERWOOD WITH MOUNTAIN BIKING? BECAUSE I THINK ULTIMATELY, THIS RESTS ON A CITY.
WE'RE BEING ASKED TO ESSENTIALLY APPROVE SING THAT CITY PARKLAND, CITY PROPERTY.
BY DESIGN ANY ISSUES RELATED TO PARK, EVEN IF THERE'S VOLUNTEER EFFORTS TO MAINTAIN OR REPORT THINGS EVERY TIME ULTIMATELY FALL TO OUR CITY MAINTENANCE TEAMS, PARKS TEAMS, THAT SORT OF THING.
I GUESS MY QUESTION IS, HAVE THERE BEEN WITH THE RIDERS THAT YOU'VE COACHED OR THE TEAMS CURRENTLY USING WHAT WE ALREADY DO HAVE IN PLACE, EVEN IF INFORMALLY, I SUPPOSE.
IN BEDERWOOD, HOW HAS THAT BEEN HANDLED? ARE THERE ISSUES FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF THE COACHES WHO ARE MAINTAINING THOSE PARKLAND TRAILS RIGHT NOW.
>> THERE AREN'T TRAILS IN BEDERWOOD.
THEY'RE LITERALLY JUST RIDING ON THE GRASS.
>> THEY'RE JUST RIDING ON THE GRASS.
>> EXACTLY. THERE'S NOTHING TO MAINTAIN.
WE DID TALK ABOUT DOING TRAILS AT BEDERWOOD PARK, WHICH IS A WHOLE ANOTHER STORY, BUT THAT DIDN'T GO WELL.
THERE WAS A LAWSUIT, AND IT DELAYED DEVELOPMENT FOR MANY YEARS.
IT WOULD HAVE BEEN A MUCH SMALLER AREA AND MUCH LESS GOOD THAN THIS, SO WE ABANDON THAT.
WITHOUT THAT ISSUE, THEY LITERALLY ARE JUST RIDING ON THE GRASS AREAS BETWEEN FIELDS.
>> I ASSUME THAT THERE'S, PRECAUTIONS THAT ARE TAUGHT TO KIDS THAT ARE LEARNING HOW TO RIDE.
BUT THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME DANGER IN THIS, EVEN IF IT'S A GREEN TRAIL.
WHAT ARE THE LIABILITY ISSUES FOR THE CITY IN ESSENTIALLY SPONSORING A TRAIL LIKE THIS?
[01:55:07]
SHARE IT TO OUR COUNSEL HERE.>> YOU COULD ASK MR. MAYOR AND E DANA.
I WOULD SAY WE WOULD ADD IT TO THE LIST TO MAKE SURE YOU'RE FULLY AWARE OF WHAT THOSE ISSUES ARE BECAUSE THERE PROBABLY IS SOME THAT YOU WOULD NEED TO KNOW ABOUT.
>> WE ARE GENERALLY COVERED IN OUR PARKS AS FAR AS LIABILITY IS CONCERNED EITHER BY THE LAW, THE WAY THE LAW WORKS, AND OR OUR OVERALL COMPREHENSIVE INSURANCE PLAN.
>> BECAUSE WE'RE SPONSORING A SPORT THAT MIGHT BE MORE DANGEROUS THAN SWINGING ON A SWING SET.
>> POTENTIALLY, I DON'T KNOW THE INS AND OUTS OF HOW THE ADJUSTER WOULD LOOK AT A GREEN MOUNTAIN BIKING TRAIL, BUT, WE HAVE OTHER RISKS RESIDENTS PARKS THAT JUST COME FROM WALKING ON TRAILS AND SWIMMING AT THE BEACHES AND TRAILS, THOSE THINGS.
>> JOE, DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THIS?
THIS WAS WORKED DONE BEFORE, I WAS WITH THE CITY.
THE PARKS COMMISSION DID VOTE TO MOVE IT FOR YOU GUYS TO APPROVE THE COMP PLAN.
THERE ARE DEFINITELY CONCERNS WITH STAFF, INCLUDING GREG AND KIM AT THE GOLF COURSE.
THERE WOULD NEED TO BE THOSE QUESTIONS ANSWERED GOING FORWARD.
SIMILAR CONCERNS THAT I HAVE FOR PARKING.
THE IMPACT ON GOLFERS, THE IMPACT ON THE COURSE ITSELF, THINGS LIKE THAT.
THAT'S WHERE WE'RE AT ON IT AT THIS POINT IN THE PROCESS.
>> QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS. OTHERWISE, I'D ENTERTAIN A MOTION.
>> YOU CAN MAKE A MOTION. WE CAN HAVE DISCUSSION THEN AFTER A MOTION, I SUPPOSE.
IF WE'RE NOT READY TO VOTE ON IT, WE CAN LEAVE IT TO THE TABLE AS WELL, BUT THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF WORK PUT INTO THIS.
NEED SOME GUIDANCE FROM THE COUNCIL.
>> I'M NOT READY TO VOTE ON IT.
NOW THAT JOE'S MENTIONED THAT THERE ARE SOME CONCERNS FROM THE GOLF STAFF.
I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR THAT BEFORE WE GO AHEAD WITH A DESIGN.
I HAVE A HARD TIME WITH THEM GOING THROUGH THE GOLF COURSE.
I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE JUST TRYING TO FIND A WAY TO THE LOOSE LINE AND STUFF.
BUT IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S VERY IMPACTFUL ON THE GOLF COURSE.
BUT I CERTAINLY WOULDN'T NEED MORE INFORMATION.
>> I THINK I COULD SPEAK FOR BRIAN AND PROBABLY THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS FOR FIVE OR SIX YEARS.
DON'T TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY, BUT I'D REALLY RATHER HAVE YOU DECIDE YES OR NO.
WE'RE AT A POINT NOW WHERE TABLING IT JUST DELAYS THE NEED TO DECIDE WHETHER YOU WANT TO GET THE REST OF THE INFORMATION.
WE HAVEN'T HEARD ANY CONCERNS THAT WE DON'T THINK WE COULD EASILY HANDLE, BUT ALL OF THE QUESTIONS WE HAVE CAN BE ANSWERED BY GOING TO THE NEXT PHASE.
IT'S A PRETTY REASONABLE AMOUNT.
WE VOTED UNANIMOUSLY TO RECOMMEND IT.
I REALIZE IT WAS A PAST COMMISSION, BUT IT WAS THE COMMISSION AT THE TIME.
YOU'VE HEARD FROM THE COMMUNITY.
IF YOU DON'T WANT TO DO THIS, IT'S OKAY TO SAY NO.
I THINK THEN THERE WON'T BE A MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL IN ORONO, BECAUSE I'M NOT GOING TO KEEP LOOKING.
WE'VE JUST REALLY GONE TO THE LENGTH.
I WOULD TOTALLY RESPECT YOUR DECISION, BUT I WOULD HONESTLY ASK YOU NOT TO TABLE IT, IF POSSIBLE, IS TO, ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, UP OR DOWN, LET US KNOW.
BEFORE MAKING A MOTION, I SUPPOSE, I'D LIKE TO ADDRESS SOME OF MY THOUGHTS ABOUT IT.
>> FIRST OF ALL, I THANK EVERYONE WHO'S SPOKEN ON THIS TONIGHT, AND I DO THINK IT'S COMMENDABLE WHEN PEOPLE FIND ACTIVITIES THAT THEY COMMIT TO, WHETHER IT'S KIDS OR ADULTS, AND I THINK RECREATING IN ANY CITY, INCLUDING ORONO IS A REALLY IMPORTANT THING TO DO, AND I DO SUPPORT USE OF OUR PARKS.
[02:00:02]
THE ISSUES ABOUT MOUNTAIN BIKING AT THIS LOCATION IN THE CITY OF ORONO THAT CONCERN ME ARE THAT OUR CITY GOVERNMENT HERE IN ORONO WOULD BE BEARING THIS PROJECT FOR NOW GOING FORWARD.AS I MENTIONED EARLIER TONIGHT WITH REGARD TO HACKBERRY AND OTHER PARKS, AND FROM THE DISCUSSION IN OUR WORK SESSION, PARK DOLLARS ARE SCARCE IN OUR CITY.
WE HAVE MANY, TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS IN MAINTENANCE AT THE GOLF COURSE, STARTING THERE AND EXTENDING INTO OTHER PARKS.
WE HAVE IRRIGATION ISSUES AT THE PARKS, AT GOLF COURSE.
WE HAVE THE MAINTENANCE SHED THERE THAT HOUSES EQUIPMENT THAT'S BEEN FLOODING SINCE BEFORE I WAS SEATED, AND THAT THOSE ARE UNRESOLVED.
WE HAD LANDSCAPING, I THINK THAT WAS MEANT TO BE PART OF THE NEW PICNIC STRUCTURE THERE THAT HAS NOT BEEN ADDRESSED THUS FAR.
WHILE THIS IS ONLY $15,000 ON THE CONTINUUM, IT'S DIFFICULT FOR ME TO SUPPORT A NEW PROJECT, NEW INFRASTRUCTURE FOR A GOLF COURSE THAT JUST CELEBRATED 100 YEAR ANNIVERSARY, WELL LOVED, AND I THINK WE ARE AT A PLACE NOW WHERE WE CAN START TO SAVE THROUGH THE CIP TO ADDRESS SOME OF THIS BACKLOG MAINTENANCE.
IT'S A WELL USED COURSE, BUT IT DOES REQUIRE MAINTENANCE, AND IT REQUIRES A COMMITMENT OF OUR CITY TO FOCUS ON THIS ASSET TO ENSURE THAT IT IS CONTINUED TO PRODUCE REVENUE FOR YEARS TO COME BECAUSE TAKING ON NEW PROJECTS WHEN WE HAVE A NUMBER OF BACKLOG PROJECTS THAT HAVE GONE UNADDRESSED FOR A VERY LONG TIME, TO ME, DOES NOT SEEM THE MOST FISCALLY RESPONSIBLE DECISION AT THIS TIME.
THERE ARE A LOT OF UNANSWERED QUESTIONS HERE, AND I CAN EMPATHIZE WITH THE FACT THAT YOUNG FOLKS ARE INTERESTED IN HAVING PLACES TO RIDE.
I THINK IF IT WERE UP TO A CITY GOVERNMENT, WHETHER IT'S ORONO OR ANY CITY TO BEAR THE WEIGHT OF EACH RECREATIONAL REQUEST THAT CAME ITS WAY, I THINK THAT IT'S NOT SUSTAINABLE OVER TIME, AND WE DO HAVE A FIDUCIARY RESPONSIBILITY TO OUR RESIDENTS TO ENSURE THAT THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND THE PROJECTS WE TAKE ON, WE CAN TAKE ON AND HANDLE WELL.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS ABOUT PRIVATE DONATION, FUND-RAISING.
AT THE SAME TIME IT'S A CITY PARK, IT'S A CITY ASSET, AND I HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THE SUSTAINABILITY OF THIS OVER TIME, THE IMPACT TO GOLF, WHICH IS A VERY HISTORIC AND IMPORTANT REVENUE SOURCE FOR THE CITY.
AT THIS TIME, I SHOULD SAY, WITH REGARD TO THIS PARK IN ORONO, I'M NOT SUPPORTIVE OF THIS.
>> OTHER THOUGHTS? QUESTIONS? READY FOR A MOTION?
>> I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO DENY THE PROPOSAL FOR A MOUNTAIN BIKE DESIGN PROPOSAL NOT TO EXCEED $15,000 AT ORONO ORCHARDS GOLF COURSE.
>> BEEN MOVED AND SECONDED, IS THERE FURTHER DISCUSSION?
>> ONE OF THE THINGS FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, THOUGH, TOO, IS THAT THAT $15,000 WILL HELP ANSWER A LOT OF THOSE QUESTIONS THAT WE HAVE AT THE END OF THE DAY.
WE'RE SPENDING SOME MONEY TO HELP ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS, WHETHER IT CAN BE DONE, AND WE'RE DENYING THAT PROCESS TO DO THAT.
>> THAT'S WHAT THE MOTION IS, YES.
>> I THINK GIVEN THE AMOUNT OF WORK AND THE INTEREST THAT THE COMMUNITY HAS IN THIS, THAT IT MIGHT BE WORTH IT TO SPEND THE $15,000 TO ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.
I HAVE SERIOUS QUESTIONS ABOUT IT.
I THINK THOSE QUESTIONS PROBABLY SHOULD BE ANSWERED AND I'M WILLING TO STAND BEHIND $15,000 TO GET THOSE ANSWERS TO THOSE QUESTIONS. OTHERS?
>> I WOULD AGREE. I THINK IT COULD BE A PRETTY QUICK AND EASY DECISION COMING DOWN WITH THOSE DECISIONS, AND ALISA, UNDERSTANDING THAT THERE IS TIGHT DOLLARS THERE, AND THOSE SAME $15,000 COULD BE SPELLED ELSEWHERE.
BUT I THINK THIS IS FOR ALL THE CITIZENS OF ORONO, WE CAN ANSWER THE NEIGHBORHOOD QUESTIONS.
WE CAN ANSWER THOSE ISSUES FOR THE GOLFERS AND ALL OF THAT AND GET THOSE ANSWERS AND KNOW IT.
I WOULD BE IN FAVOR OF SPENDING THE $15,000.
[02:05:05]
>> ONE OTHER THING I WOULD LIKE TO ADD IS 15,000 IS THE COST.
WHAT WE DON'T SEE ALSO IS THE AMOUNT OF STAFF TIME.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S BEEN THUS FAR.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT WILL BE FOR THIS NEXT PHASE.
IT TAKES QUITE A LOT OF STAFF TIME ALSO TO VET PROJECTS LIKE THIS, AND THAT'S TIME THAT IS NOT SPENT ON PARKS MAINTENANCE STANDARDS AND MANY OTHER THINGS.
>> THAT'S A GOOD POINT. THAT'S A GREAT POINT.
>> I GUESS WHERE I'M AT IS, I THINK IT'S GREAT THAT WE HAVE KIDS THAT ARE MOUNTAIN BIKING, AND THEY FIND GREAT PLEASURE OUT OF THAT.
WHETHER IT'S IN OUR COMMUNITY OR OTHER COMMUNITIES, WOULD COME USE A SPACE IN ORONO TO DO THAT.
MY CONCERN IS THAT GIVEN THE DESIGN AND GIVEN HOW THE SPACE SEEMS TO LAY OUT, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF THE STUDENT ATHLETES, ESPECIALLY AT SOME OF THOSE YOUNGER AGES, GIVEN HOW THEY MAY ACCESS THE AREA THAT THEY ULTIMATELY RIDE IN.
I THINK THAT THERE'S A SAFETY RISK ASSOCIATED WITH THEIR INVOLVEMENT ON THIS COURSE DURING GOLF PLAY, GIVEN THE PROXIMITY OF SOME OF THE POTENTIAL TRAILS.
TO ME, MY IMPRESSION IS THAT WE'RE GOING TO SPEND SOME MONEY TO GET A REPORT BACK THAT IS GOING TO RE-CONFIRM MY CONCERNS.
I'M NOT IN SUPPORT OF MOVING FORWARD.
>> I AGREE WITH THOSE CONCERNS.
I JUST THINK THAT THEY HAVE THOSE SAME CONCERNS.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? OTHERWISE, I'LL CALL THE QUESTION.
THE MOTION IS TO DENY THE REQUEST FOR $15,000 TO DO A DESIGN STUDY OF THE MOUNTAIN BIKE TRAIL AT THE GOLF COURSE.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THAT MOTION TO SAY NO TO THIS SAY AYE.
>> ALL THOSE OPPOSED, SAME SIGN. AYE.
>> AYE. THE MOTION CARRIES THREE VOTES TO TWO. THANK YOU.
>> THANKS FOR ALL THE WORK YOU PUT INTO IT TOO.
>> NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS THE HIRING OF
[11. Hire Part-Time Firefighters]
PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS. SHAY, DO YOU WANT TO?>> SURE. GOOD EVENING, MAYOR, COUNCIL MEMBERS.
I GUESS, FIRST OFF, I WANT TO APOLOGIZE FOR NOT BEING HERE AT THE LAST COUNCIL SESSION WHEN THIS FIRST CAME TO YOUR ATTENTION.
I WAS OVER AT THE LONG LAKE FIRE DEPARTMENT MEETING WITH THEIR LEADERSHIP TEAM DURING THE MEETING, SO UNFORTUNATELY I COULDN'T BE AT BOTH PLACES AT ONCE.
I APOLOGIZE. I WASN'T HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE HAD ABOUT THIS ITEM.
THE PURPOSE OF THIS ACTION IS TO SEEK APPROVAL TO HIRE TWO PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS WHO WILL PROVIDE IMMEDIATE SUPPORT BY STAFFING ORONO DUTY CREW SHIFTS.
THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT HAS COMPLETED A COMPREHENSIVE ASSESSMENT OF STAFFING REQUIREMENTS TO EFFECTIVELY SUPPORT THE RECENTLY REVISED DUTY CREW SCHEDULE.
BASED ON THIS EVALUATION, WE HAVE DETERMINED THAT THE OPTIMAL NUMBER OF PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS IS 12.
CURRENTLY, THE DEPARTMENT HAS EIGHT PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS, WITH AN ADDITIONAL INDIVIDUAL IN THE PROCESS OF COMPLETING INITIAL TRAINING.
HE SHOULD BE DONE PROBABLY AROUND THANKSGIVING.
NOTABLY, ONE CURRENT PART-TIME FIREFIGHTER IS SCHEDULED TO RELOCATE OUT OF STATE IN JUNE, AND IN FACT, I RECEIVED HIS RESIGNATION LETTER OVER THE WEEKEND.
IT'S WHAT HE HAS SET FOR HIS RESIGNATION.
GIVEN THIS ONGOING STAFFING SHORTAGE, THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT IS ACTIVELY SEEKING HIGHLY QUALIFIED PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS TO JOIN OUR TEAM.
ORONO FIREFIGHTERS WILL WORK COLLABORATIVELY AND ARE WORKING COLLABORATIVELY WITH THEIR COUNTERPARTS FROM THE LONG LAKE FIRE DEPARTMENT TO DELIVER HIGH QUALITY, RELIABLE EMERGENCY SERVICES TO THE BROADER COMMUNITY.
ADDITIONALLY, ALL CURRENT AND PROSPECTIVE ORONO FIREFIGHTERS ARE EXPECTED TO COMMIT TO THE LONG-TERM SUCCESS AND SUSTAINABILITY OF THE FUTURE CONSOLIDATED FIRE DEPARTMENT.
THE SELECTION PROCESS FOR THIS POSITION INCLUDED PUBLIC JOB HOSTING, APPLICATION SCREENING, FORMAL INTERVIEWS, AND A THOROUGH BACKGROUND INVESTIGATION.
INTERVIEWS WERE CONDUCTED BY ME AND OTHER FIRE OFFICERS.
THE RECOMMENDED CANDIDATES ARE ADEN LIBEL.
HE BRINGS THREE YEARS OF EXPERIENCE AS BOTH A PAID-ON-CALL AND CAREER FIREFIGHTER WITH ANOTHER FIRE DEPARTMENT.
HE HOLDS CERTIFICATIONS IN FIREFIGHTER 1 AND FIREFIGHTER 2, FIRE OFFICER 1 AND EMERGENCY MEDICAL RESPONDER.
[02:10:03]
CAM ASLIKSON HAS SERVED FOR TWO YEARS AS A PAID-ON-CALL FIREFIGHTER WITH ANOTHER DEPARTMENT AND HOLDS CERTIFICATIONS IN FIREFIGHTER 1 AND FIREFIGHTER 2, ALONG WITH EMERGENCY MEDICAL RESPONDER.BOTH INDIVIDUALS ARE ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT JOINING THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT AND ARE EAGER TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE LONG-TERM SUCCESS OF THE FUTURE CONSOLIDATED FIRE DEPARTMENT.
AS FOR RECOMMENDED COMPENSATION, I RECOMMEND ADEN LIBEL AND CAM ASLIKSON FOR A CONDITIONAL JOB OFFER AS PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS WITH AN EFFECTIVE START DATE OF MAY 28, 2025.
STARTING PAY RATE OF $20 PER HOUR AND ENROLLED IN THE POLICE AND FIRE PFRF RETIREMENT FUND.
CONDITIONS TO THEIR EMPLOYMENT WOULD BE PASSING THE BACKGROUND CHECK, PSYCHOLOGICAL EXAM, AND PHYSICAL EXAM.
>> QUESTIONS FOR THE INTERIM CHIEF.
>> ESSENTIALLY, YOU'RE GOING TO BE DOWN TO SEVEN FIREFIGHTERS.
I KNOW THAT YOU'VE BEEN WORKING A TON WITH THE LONG LAKE FOLKS TO TRY AND SORT OUT AND PLAN OUT A FUTURE DUTY CREW MODEL BASED UPON SOME CONSOLIDATION OF THOSE HOURS AND TO TAKE INTO ACCOUNT FOR A PAID-ON-CALL POOL OF FOLKS.
COULD YOU WALK US THROUGH WHAT YOU'VE DONE TO DATE?
>> CERTAINLY. WE'VE MADE A LOT OF PROGRESS WITH THE LONG LAKE FIRE DEPARTMENT LEADERSHIP, TO WHAT WE THINK REALLY THREAD THE NEEDLE BETWEEN WHAT IS AN EFFECTIVE ON-CALL DUTY CREW STAFFING AND BALANCING THAT WITH OBVIOUSLY GAINING OR MAINTAINING THE PAID-ON-CALL, THE COMMUNITY ASPECT OF PEOPLE RESPONDING FROM HOME.
BACK AND FORTH, WE REFINED IT TO WHERE IT'S ABOUT HALF AND HALF, SO ABOUT HALF THE DAY, WE HAVE A DUTY CREW RESPONDING, OBVIOUSLY, MOSTLY DURING THE DAY, WHEN THE PAID-ON-CALL PEOPLE ARE NOT QUITE AS AVAILABLE.
THEN ONCE THOSE PEOPLE ARE AVAILABLE, WE WANT TO USE THEM.
WE WANT TO ENGAGE THEM. WE WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO SERVE THEIR COMMUNITIES.
THERE IS A LITTLE BIT OF AN OVERLAP DURING THE DINNER PERIOD, BUT THAT IS ALSO THE BROADER COMMUNITY'S GREATEST DEMAND FOR FIRE AND RESCUE SERVICES.
WE REALLY THINK WE CAME UP WITH A WIN-WIN AND A REAL POSITIVE OUTCOME FOR NOT JUST THE PAID-ON-CALL FIREFIGHTERS AND THE PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS, BUT ULTIMATELY THE COMMUNITY IN GENERAL.
>> I APPRECIATE THAT BECAUSE I KNOW YOU SHARED THAT WITH ME EARLIER TODAY IN AN EMAIL, BUT I THOUGHT THE REST OF THE FOLKS WOULD REALLY WANT TO HEAR THAT.
WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE DUTY CREW MODEL THAT THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT WAS RUNNING UNDER AND WHAT WE'RE TRANSITIONING TO NOW OR 6-1 OR WHENEVER THAT OFFICIAL DATE STARTS, ABOUT HOW MANY HOURS A WEEK ARE WE PULLING BACK ON DUTY CREW BECAUSE WE HAVE A PAID-ON-CALL GROUP?
>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. WE WERE ORIGINALLY, I WOULD SAY, OVERALL, ABOUT 15%, WHICH DOESN'T SEEM SIGNIFICANT, BUT THAT'S WITH AN OPTIONAL THIRD SPOT FOR DUTY CREW.
IF YOU TAKE THAT OUT, IT'S ABOUT A 33% REDUCTION IN DUTY CREW PERSONNEL HOURS PER WEEK?
>> WHAT ARE THE HOURS THAT YOU'VE ESTABLISHED FOR THE DUTY CREWS?
>> YES. THE DUTY CREW MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY WOULD BE 7:00 AM-8:00 PM, AND SATURDAY WOULD BE 8:00 AM-4:00 PM, AND SUNDAY WOULD BE ALL THE PAID-ON-CALL RESPONSE.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK IS GREAT IS I KNOW THAT YOU GUYS HAVE WORKED TOGETHER TO COME TO THAT DECISION, AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK BOTH, AND I'LL JUST MENTION CODY AND MIKE, AS WELL AS PARTNERING WITH YOU AND THE REST OF THE OFFICERS IS THAT THERE'S A LOT OF EMOTION THAT GOES INTO THESE CHANGES AND MAKING THESE DECISIONS AND SETTLING IN ON THE STUFF.
I THINK THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I'VE HEARD FROM BOTH DEPARTMENTS IS, WE WANT TO LAND IN A GOOD SPOT, BUT WE'LL CONTINUE TO ASSESS WHAT THAT SHOULD LOOK LIKE AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE COGNIZANT OF THAT.
FOR EXAMPLE, I KNOW THAT THE DUTY CREW HOURS THAT SHAY JUST EXPLAINED SEEM TO BE A REALLY GOOD COMPROMISE IN HOW TO INCORPORATE PAID-ON-CALL.
KNOWING THAT IN ADDITION TO THE PAID-ON-CALL AND THE DUTY CREW HOURS, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT LONG LAKE IS DOING IS THEY'RE MODIFYING THEIR APPROACH TO TONING EVERYBODY OUT.
THEY'RE ALSO TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE DUTY CREW MODEL.
THERE'S A LOT OF ENERGY AROUND REALLY
[02:15:02]
UNDERSTANDING HOW BOTH OF THOSE DYNAMICS FIT AND SERVE OUR COMMUNITY.IT'S BEEN REALLY GOOD. I ALSO LIKE THE FACT THAT YOU'VE CREATED AN APPROACH, I'LL CALL IT THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT DUTY CREW, BUT IT'S REALLY THE JOINT DUTY CREW, AND AS DESCRIBED IN THE DOCUMENTS THAT WE PUT TOGETHER AND SIGNED WITH LONG LAKE, IS THAT THE PRIORITY STILL REMAINS WITH THE ORONO PART-TIME FIRE DEPARTMENT MEMBERS BEING ABLE TO STAFF THOSE POSITIONS, THEY HAVE A PRIORITY.
BUT YOU'VE ALSO CREATED A THIRD SPOT WITHIN THE DUTY CREW TO ALLOW FOR LONG LAKE TO HAVE SOMEONE JOIN THAT AS WELL.
I THINK THAT ALL OF THE STEPS THAT YOU'RE TAKING, TO ME, REALLY START TO JUST GIVE US THAT PATH FORWARD OF REALLY BEING COLLABORATIVE.
WE KNOW THAT IT'S GOING TO BE BUMPY, AND WE KNOW THAT THINGS ARE GOING TO TAKE TIME TO DO, BUT I THINK THAT THE WORK THAT'S BEEN PUT IN HAS JUST BEEN REALLY THOUGHTFUL, AND I THINK YOU'VE DONE A GOOD JOB.
I DO THINK THAT ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I HAD BASED UPON THE NUMBERS THAT I HAVE, IT LOOKS LIKE THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO HAVE ROUGHLY 146 DUTY CREW HOURS.
IS THERE AN EXPECTATION WITH OUR PART-TIME FIREFIGHTERS IN THE NUMBER OF HOURS THAT THEY WORK? THAT'S THE PLAN.
>> WE HAVE ALWAYS TRIED TO KEEP THEM AROUND 25 PER FIREFIGHTER.
>> JUST LIKE ANY INDUSTRY, THERE'S AVAILABILITY EBBS AND FLOWS.
SOMEBODY GETS HURT, SOMEBODY IS SICK, OUR FIREFIGHTERS ALSO LIKE TO GO ON VACATION, THINGS LIKE THAT, SO WE DO NEED A LITTLE BIT OF SHRINKAGE IN OUR STAFFING.
THAT'S WHERE WE ARRIVED AT THAT 12 NUMBER.
THERE'S ALSO TRAINING OF PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT AND THINGS THAT OCCUR.
WE TRIED TO TAKE ALL OF THE ASPECTS OF OUR STAFFING INTO CONSIDERATION TO ARRIVE AT THAT NUMBER.
IT WASN'T JUST THE STRAIGHT HOURS DIVIDED BY FIREFIGHTERS.
>> THAT'S WHERE I CAME UP WITH.
I WAS JUST DOING IT ABSENT, SOME OF THE TIME AWAY, BUT WHEN YOU START TO PUT THE NUMBERS LIKE THIS, TO ME, IT STARTS TO MAKE SENSE TO GET TO THAT 10, GET TO THAT 12, KNOWING THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE FOLKS THAT HAVE GONE OR UNAVAILABLE OR WHAT THE CASE MIGHT BE.
WHAT I AM GOING TO BE INTERESTED IN IS AS THOSE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT OF PART-TIMERS, THAT EBBS AND FLOWS, WHERE THE PAIN ON CALL FIREFIGHTER FROM LONG LAKE, MAYBE EVEN INSERTED IN PLACE OF AN ORONO PART TIME POSITION JUST BECAUSE OF THE AVAILABILITY.
BUT GIVEN HOW YOU'VE APPROACHED THIS, AND WHAT I THINK YOU'RE DOING WITH TRYING TO GET TO A STAFF LEVEL THAT ACCOMMODATES A VARIETY OF FACTORS AND STILL REMAINS COMMITTED TO, THIS IS NOT ASPIRATIONAL.
THIS IS WHAT YOU'LL SEE FROM THIS DEPARTMENT SERVING THE COMMUNITY, AND WORKING WITH FOLKS OR YOUR PARTNERS IN LONG LAKE.
I THINK IT'S BEEN A PRETTY QUICK MONTH AND A HALF, PROBABLY.
OBVIOUSLY I WORK WITH A TEAM OF EXTREMELY DEDICATED PROFESSIONALS OVER AT THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT.
I REALIZE THAT I'M HERE TALKING TO YOU, BUT IT'S REALLY ALL OF US WHO HAVE CRAFTED THIS AND ARE COMMITTED TO MAKING THIS CONSOLIDATION WORK FOR THE COMMUNITY.
>> OTHER QUESTIONS, [INAUDIBLE]?
>> I GUESS I HAVE THE QUESTION OF, SO IF WE HIRE THESE FOLKS, WHICH IS GREAT BECAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE THE NEED IS THERE AND STUFF, WHAT HAPPENS TO THEM AFTER WE MERGE THE DEPARTMENTS? THEY COME ON AS PART OF THE TEAM STILL. THANK YOU.
>> YES. THAT'S THE PLAN. THE IDEA IS WE MERGE.
THOSE WHO WISH JOIN THE NEW DEPARTMENT FROM ORONO AND FROM LONG LAKE, ARE GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO.
>> I'M SURE THEY'VE HEARD THAT THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN, SO THEY'RE WELL AWARE OF WHAT'S GOING ON.
IN FACT, THEY WERE THE ONES WHO NOTIFIED ME THAT IT WAS TABLED ON THE LAST SESSION VIA PHONE.
THEY'RE DIALED IN. THEY KNOW EXACTLY WHAT'S GOING ON, THEY'RE UP TO SPEED, AND THEY'RE EXCITED TO GET STARTED, IF THAT'S WHAT THE COUNCIL CHOOSES TO DO.
>> YEAH. THAT WAS MY QUESTION.
>> I WOULD NOTE THAT OUR JPA TERM SHEET CONTEMPLATES THAT WE WILL HAVE A DUTY CREW MODEL THAT WILL BE FOLLOWED WITH THE COMBINED DEPARTMENT.
THESE FOLKS WILL, HOPEFULLY, STAY AND FORM THE NUCLEUS OF THAT DUTY CREW.
>> I THINK IT'S GREAT, THEY'RE EMR CERTIFIED TOO.
[02:20:02]
>> MORE THAN EVER. I MEAN, THAT'S REALLY KEY, I BELIEVE.
>. I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY TO PIGGY BACK.
I THINK IT'S GREAT TO HEAR THAT YOU'RE MEETING AS FREQUENTLY AS YOU ARE AND THAT YOU ARE PROBLEM SOLVING THE OPERATIONAL PIECE JOINTLY, WHICH IS THE INTENTION, AND WHAT WILL CONTINUE TO HAPPEN. I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING FURTHER.
TOUCHE, I JUST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU.
LAST WEEK, I GOT TO SPEND TIME WITH YOU AS YOU WENT THROUGH THAT.
YOU STEPPED INTO A POSITION THAT YOU WEREN'T PLANNING ON STEPPING INTO, AND FROM ALL SIGNS HERE, YOU'RE WORKING WELL TOGETHER NOW.
>> DOES ANYONE CARE TO MAKE A MOTION?
>> YEAH. I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO HIRE, AS WRITTEN, ADEN AND CAM, AS PART TIME FIREFIGHTERS.
>> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
ATTORNEY REPORT. DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING FOR US?
[Attorney Report]
MAYBE INTRODUCE YOURSELF AS SOREN'S PARTNER.>> YES. I'M [INAUDIBLE], AND HAPPY TO BE HERE, FILLING IN FOR SOREN.
HE WILL BE BACK FOR THE NEXT MEETING.
SORRY ABOUT THE LITTLE MIC THING BEFORE.
THERE'S A SIGN HERE THAT SAYS, "TEST YOUR MIKE", BUT I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT YOU MEANT [LAUGHTER].
>> WELL, THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT.
CITY ADMINISTRATOR ENGINEER REPORT. MR. EDWARDS.
[12. 2026 Street Improvement Project Planning and Engineering (Project #26-001)]
>> I'LL BRING UP A PRESENTATION REAL QUICK.
PART OF WHAT I'M GOING TO GO OVER WITH YOU IS WHAT WE WOULD HAVE DONE AT THE WORK SESSION, THE WORK SESSION THAT WAS CANCELED DUE TO THE INCLEMENT WEATHER.
I'LL TRY TO ABBREVIATE THAT A LITTLE BIT AND JUST COVER HOW WE DO ROAD MAINTENANCE.
THE REAL ITEM TODAY IS TO APPROVE INITIATION OF THE DESIGN FOR NEXT YEAR'S ROADS.
THAT FITS ALL WITHIN OUR PAVEMENT MANAGEMENT PLANNING PROCESS, AND SO I WANTED TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HOW THAT NORMALLY WORKS.
WE'LL TALK ABOUT THE PROCESS, HOW WE DO PAVEMENT MAINTENANCE, AND THEN GET INTO PARTICULARS OF ROADS FOR NEXT YEAR.
WE'VE HAD THIS STRATEGY, THESE FOUR PRINCIPLES OF HOW WE MAINTAIN OUR ROAD PAVEMENTS FOR MANY YEARS.
WE'RE TRYING TO MAXIMIZE THE PAVEMENT LIFE VIA PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE, SO A LITTLE BIT OF MAINTENANCE UPFRONT CAN HELP A PIECE OF PAVEMENT LAST MUCH LONGER.
THERE'S A CHART PULLED OUT OF ONE OF THE LOCAL ROADS RESEARCH BOARD DOCUMENTS, SHOWING A DETERIORATION CURVE OVER TIME, AND THERE'LL BE A COUPLE OTHER VERSIONS OF THIS AS WE GO THROUGH THIS.
BUT THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS IS THE PAVEMENT IS GOING TO DETERIORATE, NO MATTER WHAT WE DO.
BUT WE CAN DO SOME THINGS THAT MAKE THAT CURVE EXTEND TO THE RIGHT AND FOR THAT PAVEMENT TO LAST LONGER.
OUR PAVEMENTS ARE NOT IN CONSIDERABLE AMOUNTS OF PUBLIC INVESTMENT, SO TRYING TO DO THINGS THAT CAN GET THE MOST LIFE OUT OF IT AND PAYS OFF, PAYS DIVIDENDS.
AS PART OF THAT, WE DO REGULAR INSPECTIONS AND ASSESSMENT, BOTH INTERNAL WITH OUR STREET STAFF, JUST BEING OUT ON OUR PAVEMENTS REGULARLY, DOING THE ROUTINE MAINTENANCE, AND THEN AS A CITY ENGINEER, I TAKE ABOUT 20% OF THE CITY-OWNED PAVEMENTS A YEAR, AND I WILL DO A MORE FORMAL INSPECTION OF THOSE THROUGHOUT THE SUMMER, JUST TO SEE WHERE THEY ARE AND HOW THEY'RE CHANGING WITH TIME.
THE OTHER THING. AS PART OF OUR STRATEGY OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS IS WE DO TRY TO GROUP NEIGHBORHOODS WHEN WE GO INTO AN AREA TO DO A PROJECT.
WE MAY HAVE A PIECE OF PAVEMENT THAT'S JUST TERRIBLE.
WE NEED TO GET AFTER THAT RIGHT AWAY.
BUT ADJACENT TO IT MIGHT BE A PIECE OF PAVEMENT THAT IS NOT TERRIBLE, BUT IT'S GOING TO NEED SOME MAINTENANCE IN THE NEAR FUTURE ANYWAY, SO WE'LL TRY TO GROUP THOSE THINGS, SO WE MAY BE RECONSTRUCTING THIS PIECE OF PAVEMENT, BUT ADJACENT TO IT, WE'LL BE DOING A LESSER OPERATION LIKE A MILL AND OVERLAY, JUST REPLACING THE VERY TOP LAYER, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
PART OF THE IDEA IS OUR ROAD PROJECTS CAN BE DISRUPTIVE TO A NEIGHBORHOOD, AND SO THEREFORE WHEN WE GO IN, WE WANT TO GO IN ONCE.
THEY DON'T WANT TO SEE US AGAIN YEAR AFTER YEAR, COMING IN AND SHUTTING DOWN ROADS AND DOING THAT WORK, SO WE DO TRY TO [INAUDIBLE].
THE OTHER THING IS, RESOURCES ARE LIMITED, SO OUR CREWS DO SOME PATCHING, AND THEN WE ALSO DO SOME CONTRACT PATCHING, WHERE MAYBE MOST OF THE ROAD SEGMENT IS IN OKAY CONDITION, BUT THERE'S THIS 100 FEET OR SO THAT ARE REALLY BAD.
WE'LL JUST GO AFTER THAT 100 FEET UNTIL THE ENTIRE ROAD IS READY TO HAVE A DIFFERENT TREATMENT.
[02:25:05]
THE KEY IS DOING THE RIGHT TREATMENT AT THE RIGHT TIME, AGAIN, ANOTHER VARIATION OF THE CURVE THERE AT THE TOP LEFT.THEN OVER ON THE RIGHT SIDE, JUST THE LIFE OF A ROAD PAVEMENT WITH AN EXPECTED LIFESPAN OF ABOUT 50 YEARS, THAT'S INCLUDING DOING A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT TECHNIQUES.
WE'LL COVER A COUPLE OF THOSE IN A MINUTE, BUT EVERYTHING FROM CHIP CEILING AND CRACK CEILING TO A MILL AND OVERLAY PROCESS TO DOING OVERLAYS AND RECLAIMS ON THE ROAD OVER TIME IS ALL OF THE VARIOUS DIFFERENT THINGS THAT WE DO TO TRY TO GET THAT ROAD TO LAST.
IN THE BOTTOM LEFT HERE, I HAVE JUST A TYPICAL ROAD SEGMENT JUST TO ILLUSTRATE A LITTLE BIT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
WHEN WE ACTUALLY BUILD A ROAD, WE START WITH LOOKING FOR A DECENT SUBGRADE, THAT'S THAT NATIVE SOIL.
YOU HAVE TO REMOVE ALL THE ORGANICS AND THINGS, YOU WANT TO GET RID OF AS MUCH CLAY AS YOU CAN, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT THE ROAD DOESN'T.
THEN NORMALLY WE HAVE ABOUT 8" OR SO OF AGGREGATE, SO CLASS 5, YOU'LL OFTEN HEAR IT TALKED ABOUT.
THEN ON TOP OF THAT, WE HAVE TWO LAYERS OF ASPHALT, WHAT WE CALL A BASE COURSE AND AND A WEAR COURSE OF ASPHALT.
A LOT OF WHAT WE DO IN THE PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE OF THE ASPHALT IS ADDRESSING THIS VERY TOP LAYER AND DOING VARIOUS THINGS SO THAT WE CAN STOP, PARTICULARLY THE WATER PENETRATION, FROM GETTING IN AND GETTING IN BETWEEN THESE OTHER LAYERS IN THE ASPHALT, AND THAT'S WHERE YOU START SEEING THE POT HOLES AND THE OTHER NEGATIVE THINGS ON THE PAVEMENT OCCURRING.
A LOT OF TIMES WHEN I'LL BE COMING TO YOU FOR DIFFERENT THINGS I WANT TO DO, I'M REALLY TALKING ABOUT TRYING TO DO SOMETHING WITH THAT TOP LAYER.
A COUPLE EXAMPLES OF THAT THAT WE DO PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE AS WE DO CRACK SEALING.
WHEN YOU GO OUT AND YOU SEE ALL THESE DARK BLACK LINES ON THE ROAD, THAT IS WHERE WE'VE DONE SOME CRACK SEALING.
SOMETIMES RIGHT AFTER THEY DO CRACK SEALING, THEY USE TOILET PAPER SO THAT IT DOESN'T STICK TO THE CAR TIRES.
YEAH, THAT'S NOT VANDALISM BY SOME KID, OUR TOILET PAPER.
THAT'S PART OF THE CRACK SEALING PROCESS TO PROTECT IT FOR THOSE FEW MINUTES TILL IT FULLY DRIES.
>> IT IS REALLY. IF YOU SEE THEM OUT THERE, THEY'D HAVE A ROLL OF TOILET PAPER ON THEM, BASICALLY ON A LITTLE STICK THING, AND THEY'RE JUST WALKING.
>> YEAH. ALL WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS THERE'S A CRACK IN THAT TOP LAYER, AND WE'RE TRYING TO FILL IT.
YOU'LL ALSO OFTEN SEE WHEN WE DO THAT, CREWS WILL BE OUT ACTUALLY ROUTING, MAKING THE CRACK A LITTLE BIT BIGGER AND GETTING RID OF ANY LOOSE MATERIAL, AND THEN PUTTING THE CRACK SEAL IN THERE.
THAT IS AN OPERATION THAT IS RUN AND MANAGED BY OUR STREETS MAINTENANCE TEAM AND DJ'S CREW.
YOU ACTUALLY ALREADY APPROVED OUR PROJECT FOR THIS YEAR ON THE CRACK SEALING, SO THANK YOU.
WE'LL DO THAT. WE HAVE A SMALL CRACK SEALING PROJECT EVERY YEAR.
THE OTHER THING WE HAVEN'T BEEN DOING AS MUCH, IN THE LAST FEW YEARS IS CHIP SEALING, WHICH IS BASICALLY APPLYING ANOTHER LAYER OF TAR, SO TO SPEAK, ASPHALT WITH SMALLER ROCKS THAT ARE THEN COMPACTED INTO THAT.
WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO THERE IS FILL A WHOLE BUNCH OF MICROCRACKS THAT ARE OCCURRING ON THE TOP OF THE PAVEMENT, AS WELL AS ASPHALT LIKE ANY OTHER THING THAT'S EXPOSED TO THE SUN, IT OXIDIZES, AND IT STARTS LOSING ITS STRENGTH.
THIS PROVIDES ANOTHER SACRIFICIAL WEAR COURSE ON TOP OF THE WEAR COURSE TO TRY TO GET IT TO LAST A LITTLE BIT LONGER.
>> IS IT TRUE THAT THAT WOULD BE MOSTLY APPLIED TO HEAVIER TRAFFIC ROADS, NECESSARILY CITY STREETS THAT HAVE VERY LITTLE TRAFFIC?
>> NO, NOT NECESSARILY. ACTUALLY, A LOT OF TIMES IT'S THE EXACT OPPOSITE.
>> IN FACT, HENNEPIN COUNTY, JUST IN THE LAST MAYBE THREE YEARS, STARTED GOING BACK TO CHIP SEALING.
THEY FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS DIDN'T DO CHIP SEALING.
THEY WOULD JUST WAIT AND DO WHAT'S CALLED A MILL AND OVERLAY, WHICH IS WHERE YOU REMOVE A PORTION OR ALL OF THIS WEAR COURSE AND THEN JUST PUT A NEW ONE DOWN.
THEY WOULD ONLY DO THAT. THE LAST FEW YEARS, THEY'VE STARTED DOING CHIP SEALING.
IN FACT, THEY HAVE A PLAN TO DO COUNTY ROAD 6 NEXT YEAR.
THEY WILL CHIP SEAL THAT AND THEN RESTRIPE IT.
IT'S A GOOD INTERIM STEP AGAIN TO SEAL THOSE MICROVOIDS, AND THEN ALSO DEAL WITH THAT OXIDATION AND PROVIDE THAT ADDITIONAL WEAR COURSE, ARTIFICIAL WEAR COURSE.
[02:30:01]
>> I WAS JUST GOING TO ASK YOU, THESE ARE JUST OUR ORONO ROADS, RIGHT? LIKE BROWN ROAD, WHICH THEY'RE DOING RIGHT NOW, WE WOULDN'T DO THIS MAINTENANCE ON IT.
WE WOULD RELY ON THE COUNTY TO DO THAT OR STATE, OR WOULD WE TAKE CARE OF THAT AS WELL?
>> NO, WE ONLY DO OUR ROADS, CITY ROADS.
>> YEAH. I WAS JUST GIVE AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE COUNTY WAS DOING.
>> NO, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT JUST FROM [INAUDIBLE].
>> WE COORDINATE AND WORK TOGETHER, BUT THEY RUN THEIR OWN PAVEMENT MAINTENANCE.
>> WHEN YOU DO A MILL AN OVERLAY, IS IT ALWAYS TAKING OUT A PART OF THAT 1.5 INCH COP OR SOMETIMES YOU JUST PAVE OVER THE TOP OF A ROAD?
>> THAT WOULD JUST BE AN OVERLAY.
YEAH, SOMETIMES WE'LL JUST DO AN OVERLAY, WE'LL ADD ANOTHER INCH AND A HALF OF ASPHALT ON TOP.
YOU CAN DO THAT ONCE, MAYBE TWICE.
WELL, THERE REALLY ISN'T A MAX, BUT WHAT YOU'LL FIND IS, AND THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENS ON ANOTHER COUNTY ROAD, COUNTY ROAD 15, WHERE OVER THE YEARS, BECAUSE COUNTY ROAD 15 IS BUILT OVER A LOT OF MARSH, AND IT SINKS A LITTLE BIT, AND SO THEY JUST DO ANOTHER OVERLAY.
WELL, NOW THEY'VE GOT PLACES WHERE THEY'VE GOT FEET OF ASPHALT.
ASPHALT IS HEAVY, O ASPHALT SINKS.
YOU CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE SOME ISSUES.
YES, THERE'S A CASE WHERE YOU CAN DO JUST AN OVERLAY.
SOMETIMES A ROAD, YOU START SEEING A LOT OF CRACKS ON A SURFACE.
IF YOU JUST OVERLAY IT, YOU GET MAYBE ONE OR TWO YEARS, AND THOSE CRACKS WILL JUST WORK THEMSELVES RIGHT UP THROUGH.
MOST OF THE TIME IN ORONO, WE'LL INCLUDE THE MILL, AND WE'LL TAKE OFF MAYBE THE FIRST INCH, THERE ARE 2" OF ASPHALT, AND THEN PUT THE SAME BACK DOWN. I GOT TO DO THOSE.
>> IS THIS A THING THAT HAPPENS WHERE THERE'S PITTING GOING ON,? WHERE ONE HOLE IN LEADS INTO SOME PITTING, IF YOU WILL, OR CREATING THOSE LITTLE HOLES THERE?
>> I'M JUST THINKING OF MY DRIVEWAY [LAUGHTER].
>>YOU MIGHT HAVE [OVERLAPPING].
>> SMALL AREAS WHERE IT'S FLAKING OFF.
YOU'LL SEE THAT HAPPEN JUST WITH A CHIP SEAL OVERTIME, SO THEN IT'S A QUARTER INCH DEEP HOLE.
>> SOMETIMES YOU'LL SEE DELAMINATION WHERE YOU'RE GETTING A SEPARATION BETWEEN THE TWO LAYERS OF ASPHALT, SO YOU'LL SEE MAYBE AN INCH, INCH AND A HALF DEEP, POTHOLES.
WHEN WE START SEEING THOSE IN DIFFERENT PLACES AND THE CRACKS, THAT'S WHERE WE'RE GOING TO DO THAT MILL AND OVERLAY.
WHEN WE START SEEING BIGGER CRACKS WHERE I CAN START SEEING THE AGGREGATE COMING UP THROUGH THE ROAD, OR IT'S GOT HUGE RUTS AND THINGS.
THAT'S WHEN WE'RE DOING PROCESSES, WE CALL IT RECLAMATION, WHICH WE'RE BASICALLY, IT'S A BIG VERSION OF A MILLING.
THEY WILL TAKE A GRINDER, AND IT'S GOING TO GRIND ALL THIS ASPHALT UP AND THE FIRST FEW INCHES OF THE ROCK.
IT'S GOING TO MIX IT ALL TOGETHER, WE'RE GOING TO LAY THAT, THAT'S GOING TO BE OUR NEW BASE, AND THEN WE'RE GOING TO BUILD THAT ASPHALT ROAD ON TOP OF IT.
>> JUST LOOKING ACROSS OUR STREETS, JUST THIS IS A PICTORIAL OF OUR ROADS BASED ON THE MOST RECENT ASSESSMENTS WE'VE HAD.
I HAVE NOT COLORED THE ROADS GREEN THAT WE'RE DOING THIS YEAR, ALTHOUGH WE HAVE A PLAN TO CHANGE THEM ALL.
BUT LOOKING AT THIS MAP, GREEN MEANS A FAIRLY NEW ROAD, WHAT WE CALL PAVEMENT CONDITION INDEX OF 80-100, WHICH IS PART OF HOW WE MARK THE ROADS.
THE YELLOW ARE SITTING RIGHT BELOW THAT.
IN GENERAL, SOMETHING THAT'S STILL GREEN, STARTING TO GO YELLOW IS SOMETHING WE MIGHT CONSIDER A CHIP SEAL FOR.
SOMETHING THAT'S IN THE YELLOW ARENA IS USUALLY SOMETHING WE'RE GOING TO DO AN OVERLAY ON OR RECOMMEND A MILL AND OVERLAY AT THAT POINT IN ITS LIFE.
WHEN WE START GETTING TO THE ORANGES AND THE REDS, THOSE ARE IN MOST CASES GOING TO BE A RECLAIM TO GET IT.
THERE ARE SOME EXCEPTIONS, AND IN FACT, BROWN ROAD IS CURRENTLY SHOWN AS AN ORANGE, BUT WE'RE ACTUALLY DOING A MILL AND OVERLAY ON IT BECAUSE WE THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH DECENT BASE UNDERNEATH IT TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT.
BUT THAT'S GENERALLY HOW IT LOOKS.
YOU CAN GET AN IDEA JUST FROM LOOKING AT THE MAP WHERE OUR PAVEMENTS SIT IN THEIR LIFESPAN AND IN THEIR CONDITION.
THE ONE GOOD THING I WOULD SAY IS THAT FOR MANY YEARS, WE HAD SEVERAL REDS ON THIS MAP AS WELL, AND WE LUCKILY, KNOCK IN THE WOOD, STILL ABLE TO KEEP OUR ROADS OUT OF THE REDS.
YOU DID NOT WANT TO DRIVE DOWN THAT ROAD.
>> THE BLACK ONES ON THIS LIST ARE NOT THE CITY'S RESPONSIBILITY, CORRECT?
>> CORRECT. MOST OF THE DARKER GRAY BLACK IS EITHER COUNTY ROADS OR OBVIOUSLY HIGHWAY 12 BEING MANAGED BY MNDOT.
[02:35:06]
>> THE STREETS ARE PRIVATELY [OVERLAPPING].
>> THE LITTLE SHORT ONES, A LOT OF THEM YOU SEE UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CITY.
THESE CUL-DE-SACS ARE ALL PRIVATE ROADS, AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT'S UNIQUE JUST TO THE WAY THAT ORONO DEVELOPED FROM THE 1980S ON, STARTED HAVING A BUNCH OF PRIVATE ROADS.
JUST IN THE LIST AND IN YOUR PACKET, I HIGHLIGHTED SOME OF THE ROADS THAT ARE IN MOST NEED THAT WE HAVE IDENTIFIED IN THE NEAR TERM.
WE ARE PROPOSING FOR NEXT YEAR TO DO NORTH ARM DRIVE AND NORTH ARM LANE.
THEN CLOSELY ON THE HEELS OF THAT, YOU CAN SEE THE OTHER ROADS THAT I HAVE LISTED IN THAT TABLE THAT ARE ALL GETTING IN NEED OF SOME ACTIVITY.
ONE OF THE THINGS TOO TO CONSIDER, AND WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT MORE IN BUDGETING, BUT WE LEVY ONE MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR FOR PAVEMENT.
THAT IS OUR CONSTRAINING ITEM FOR OUR ROAD PROJECTS.
WHEN WE DO A ROAD PROJECT, WE'RE ACTUALLY DRAWING FROM MULTIPLE DIFFERENT FUNDING SOURCES.
WE WILL PULL FROM THE SEWER FUND FOR ADJUSTING HANDHOLES.
WE PULL FROM THE WATER FUND FOR ANYTHING WE NEED TO DO WITH WATER INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S IN THE ROADWAY AND THE STORM WATER FUND FOR STORM WATER ASPECTS OF THIS.
BUT THE LIMITING FUND FOR US WHEN IT COMES TO OUR ROAD PROJECTS IS OUR PAVEMENT FUND.
WE'RE BASICALLY LEVYING A MILLION DOLLARS, SPENDING A MILLION DOLLARS EACH YEAR AS WE GO THROUGH THESE.
THE ONE EXCEPTION WE TALKED ABOUT IT WHEN WE AWARDED BROWN IS WE DO HAVE ABOUT NINE MILES OF OUR ROAD CITY ROADWAY THAT IS ELIGIBLE FOR MUNICIPAL STATE AID FUNDING.
WE DO USE THAT MONEY FOR THOSE ROADS, WHICH COMES FROM THE STATE DEBT GAS TAX OR A PIECE OF IT.
>> WELL, I GUESS IT'S '27 BEYOND.
I WAS ADDING THOSE UP, AND IT'S MORE THAN A MILLION DOLLARS BUT IT'S JUST IT.
>> AS PART OF THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN PROCESS FOR PAVEMENT, EVERY YEAR I'M COMING AND PRESENTING THOSE TO YOU IN TIME.
SOMETIMES WE MOVE THEM A LITTLE BIT DEPENDING ON MAYBE A PAVEMENTS DETERIORATING FASTER THAN WE THOUGHT, OR EVEN SOMETIMES WE'VE GOT A LOT OF RESIDENTS ON THAT ROAD.
MAYBE WE MOVE THAT ONE FORWARD VERSUS A ROAD THAT HAS FEWER RESIDENTS AND TRYING TO MAKE ALL THOSE BALANCES.
BUT THE CONSTRAINING FACTOR IS THAT PAVEMENT.
OF WHICH WE'VE GOT $50,000 THIS YEAR, BUT LOOKING FORWARD TRYING TO GET BACK UP, WHERE WE ONCE WERE HAVING ABOUT $100,000 SET ASIDE FOR THAT PREVENTATIVE STUFF, SO CHIP CEILING, THE CRACK CEILING AND SOME CONTRACT PATCHING TO KEEP THE REST OF THE ROADS HELD OVER UNTIL WE CAN GET TO THEM WITH THE RIGHT PROJECTS.
FOR 2026, WHAT WE WERE LOOKING AT IS NORTH ARM DRIVE.
I'VE HAVE THAT HIGHLIGHTED IN GREEN THERE.
LOOKING AT MOST LIKELY IT WILL BECOME A RECLAMATION PROJECT.
THAT'S THAT GRINDING UP EVERYTHING AND THEN BUILDING YOUR PAVEMENT ON TOP OF IT.
SAME THING IN BLUE THERE FOR NORTH ARM LANE.
HOWEVER, WITH THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S GOING ON TO THE NORTH OF THAT, ALSO I'VE ASKED THE DESIGNERS TO LOOK AT THAT TO SEE WHERE THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES TO MAYBE WIDEN THAT ROAD RIGHT NOW.
IT'S AS NARROW AS 16 FEET IN CERTAIN AREAS.
OUR MINIMUM STANDARD FOR THE CITY FOR NEW ROADS WILL BE 24 FEET.
I DON'T THINK WE CAN GET 24 FEET IN THERE JUST HAVING LOOKED AT IT IN SOME PLACES, BUT MAYBE WE CAN GET IT UP TO 20 FEET, WHICH WOULD GIVE YOU 210 FOOT AISLES THAT YOU CAN EASILY PASS VEHICLES PAST EACH OTHER SAFELY.
LOOKING AT THAT, DON'T KNOW THE EXACT ANSWER, BUT WANT TO LOOK AT DOING THAT.
>> DO WE OWN THE LAND ON EACH SIDE OR DO WE LEASE?
>> IT VARIES A LITTLE BIT, BUT THE RIGHT-OF-WAY IS, I THINK THE MINIMUM IS 50 FEET THERE.
WE'VE GOT ROOM, BUT THERE ARE SOME CONSTRAINTS OR SOME AREAS WHERE THE WETLANDS GET REALLY CLOSE AND THEN THERE'S JUST SOME PLACES WHERE AS WE LOOK AT THAT, WE DON'T WANT TO NECESSARILY DISTURB MAJOR LANDSCAPING THAT MAYBE THE NEIGHBORS HAVE DONE, OR THERE ARE SOME OLD GROWTH TREES.
>> A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO, WE APPROVED A DEVELOPMENT UP IN THERE.
>> GOING TO BE NEW ROAD PUT IN PAID FOR BY THE DEVELOPER?
>> DOES THAT BECOME A CITY STREET THEN, OR IS THAT THEN PRIVATELY OWNED?
>> IT IS BASED ON THE APPROVAL THAT THE COUNCIL DID, THAT NEW ROAD WILL BECOME AN EXTENSION OF THIS.
>> WHICH ACTUALLY, IN THIS CASE, A LOT OF TIMES WE ARE STILL DOING PRIVATE ROADS, BUT IN THIS CASE, IT MADE SENSE, AND HENCE THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION TO DO IT AS A PUBLIC ROAD.
IT GIVES US A CUL-DE-SAC AREA,
[02:40:01]
AND IT ALLOWS US ACTUALLY TO DO MAINTENANCE MORE EFFICIENTLY.>> A LOT OF THE CONSTRUCTION WILL BE DONE IN THAT AREA BEFORE WE PUT IN A NEW ROAD?
>> WELL, THEY HAVEN'T PUT THEIR EXACT TIMELINE TOGETHER.
NORMALLY, THESE DEVELOPERS IS ONCE THEY HAVE THE GO, THEY WILL GET THEIR ROAD INFRASTRUCTURE IN FAIRLY QUICKLY.
THEY NEED TO DO THAT IN ORDER TO DO ALL THE REST OF THEIR BUILDING.
I WOULD EXPECT THE ROAD AND THE STORM WATER STUFF TO BE DONE WITHIN A SEASON.
THEN THE HOUSES, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR SCHEDULE WOULD BE, BUT THEY MAY BE BUILDING HOUSES FOR YEARS TO COME.
THE OTHER THING I DID WANT TO POINT OUT ON THIS, AND IT HAS TO DO WITH PARKS AGAIN.
THERE WAS A FEASIBILITY STUDY DONE A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO, I PUT IT IN YOUR PACKET TO BUILD A PEDESTRIAN TRAIL ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF NORTH ARM.
I HAVE IT HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW HERE.
THE ASPIRATION WAS TO CONNECT WEST BRANT ROAD TO THE LAKEVIEW PRIVATE PUBLIC PARK THAT SITS RIGHT HERE.
WHAT WAS ENVISIONED THERE IS A FOUR FOOT WIDE GRAVEL PEDESTRIAN TRAIL, SO NOT A NOT A MULTI-USE TRAIL, SO NOT FOR NECESSARILY FOR BICYCLES.
THE PARKS COMMISSION BACK THEN, AND I THINK PROBABLY STILL NOW, SAW THE ADDITION OF A TRAIL THERE AS A PART OF THE NEXUS OF THE WHOLE DEVELOPMENT AND GOING IN AND THAT SORT OF THING IN THE AREA.
THEY DID ASK US, I THINK IT WAS 2017 OR SO TO DO A STUDY LOOKING AT WHAT THAT WOULD COST.
THAT TRAIL POTENTIALLY WILL BE A CHALLENGE TO CONSTRUCT.
IF YOU EVER GO LOOK AT THAT SECTION OF ROAD, THE EMBANKMENTS ARE STEEP.
ROAD, DITCH, EMBANKMENT, LOTS OF TREES.
I DON'T KNOW IF IT WOULD BE THE BEST USE OF RESOURCES TO BUILD THE TRAIL AS ORIGINALLY ENVISIONED, WHICH WOULD BE A FOUR FOOT SEPARATED TRAIL.
YOU WOULD GO FROM PAVEMENT TO DITCH TO EMBANKMENT, TO TRAIL.
ALL STILL WITHIN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY, BUT LOT OF DISTURBANCE THAT WOULD HAVE TO HAPPEN.
BUT ONE OF THE THINGS I THINK IT MIGHT BE WORTH DOING IS ACTUALLY INCLUDING IT IN THE PRELIMINARY DESIGN AND LOOKING TO SEE IF THERE'S A WAY THAT WE COULD PERHAPS JUST CREATE A WIDER SHOULDER ON THE ONE SIDE OF THE ROAD.
ALTHOUGH I CAN'T WHOLEHEARTEDLY ENDORSE ACTUALLY BUILDING THAT TRAIL THE WAY IT WAS FIRST ENVISIONED, LOOKING AT SEEING IF THERE IS A WAY TO IMPROVE THE ABILITY FOR PEDESTRIANS TO GET OFF THE SIDE OF THE ROAD IS PROBABLY WORTH A LOOK.
WE DO, IN THE PROPOSAL IN YOUR PACKET, HAVE A VERSION OF THAT WHERE BOLTON & MENK INCLUDED DOING SOME TRAIL DESIGNS.
>> THE ISSUE THERE IS JUST PROVIDING A SAFE CORRIDOR OR A PASSAGE FOR PEDESTRIANS, BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD BE A BIKE.
IT'S NOT INTENDED FOR BIKING, YOU SAID AT SCHOOL?
>> THE FEEDBACK WE WERE GETTING BACK IN 2017 THE MAIN CONCERN WAS FOR PEDESTRIANS, A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD WALK.
WE'RE LOOKING FOR WAYS TO WALK AND THEN CONNECT INTO THE, THERE IS A BIT OF AN INTERNAL TRAIL NETWORK IN THE DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU CAN GET TO.
I CAN'T REMEMBER. THE BIKING WAS NOT AS BIG OF A CONCERN, AND EVEN THEN WE WERE LOOKING BECAUSE IF YOU BUILD AN ACTUAL SEPARATED MULTIMODAL TRAIL, YOU'RE TALKING USUALLY MINIMUM, LIKE WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ON COUNTY ROAD 6 THERE.
IS MINIMUM EIGHT FOOT WIDE, NOW THE REGIONAL STANDARD 10 FEET OF PAVEMENT AND TRYING TO FIT THAT IN.
WE JUST COULDN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO THAT IN ANY ECONOMICAL WAY.
WE ENDED UP WITH, WELL, DO THIS PEDESTRIAN SEPARATION HELP IN ANY WAY?
>> HAVE WE EVER CONSTRUCTED SOMETHING LIKE THAT IN THE PAST? IT'S SUCH A UNIQUE SOLUTION, I GUESS I'D SAY FOR A PEDESTRIAN ISSUE.
>> WE HAVE NOT DONE BY ITSELF A SEPARATED TRAIL ALONG THE ROAD.
THE TRAIL PROJECTS WE HAVE DONE EAST LONG LAKE TRAIL, BUT THAT WAS CONVERSION OF A ROADBED INTO A TRAIL.
WE PARTNERED WITH HENNEPIN COUNTY TO DO THE TRAIL EXTENSION OF THE DAKOTA DOWN IN NAVARRE.
HAVE DONE ON SOME OF OUR PROJECTS JUST AS PART OF THE PAVEMENT PROJECT, LOOKING,
[02:45:01]
CAN WE GET ANOTHER FOOT OF SHOULDER OR SOMETHING THAT WOULD ALLOW SOMEBODY TO STEP OFF THE ROAD.A LOT OF OUR ROADS ARE NARROW, AND SO HAVING SOME PLACE WHERE A PEDESTRIAN COULD STEP OFF THE SIDE.
IT DOESN'T MEET NECESSARILY THE DESIGN STANDARDS FOR HOW YOU WOULD DO A TRAIL IF YOU WERE STARTING FROM SCRATCH, BUT WE HAVE TRIED TO LOOK, IS THERE SOME WAYS THAT WE CAN MAKE IT BETTER THAN IT IS?
>> THAT TRAIL DESIGN WOULD BE A PART OF WHAT WE'RE PAYING BOLTON & MENK FOR UNDER THIS PROPOSAL?
>> IT'S AGAIN, GOING INTO IT WITH AN OPEN MIND OF HOW DO WE DO THIS?
>> YEAH, IS THERE SOME WAY THAT WE CAN MAKE AN IMPROVEMENT WITHOUT MAYBE SPENDING AS MUCH AS IT MIGHT BE? BACK IN 2017, WE THOUGHT THE TRAIL MIGHT COST $80,000.
JUST WALKING IT THE OTHER DAY WITH THE BOLTON & MENK DESIGNER BEFORE HE GAVE ME THE PROPOSAL, HE SAID, YOU MIGHT BE 200 TODAY'S DOLLARS WITH THE AMOUNT OF. [OVERLAPPING]
>> IF WE DID A SEPARATE TRAIL.
>> YEAH. I GUESS IF IT CAME OUT AND THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT WAS $200,000, I PROBABLY AM NOT GOING TO COME TO THE CITY COUNCIL SAYING I THINK WE SHOULD DO THAT.
I THINK IT'S WORTH EXPLORING IF YOU DON'T KNOW IF IT'S WORTH DOING IT.
[LAUGHTER] SUBJECT TO YOUR QUESTIONS.
THAT'S ALL. I'LL HEAD ON THE STREETS.
>> AGAIN, WHAT WE'RE AUTHORIZING, I THINK, IS THE DESIGN WORK FOR BOLTON & MENK NOT TO EXCEED CONTRACT OF $129,000?
>> THEN JUST DIRECTING STAFF TO PROCEED WITH OUR PROPOSAL.
>> ANYBODY CARE TO MAKE A MOTION TO THAT EFFECT?
>> SURE. I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO DIRECT CITY ENGINEER TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE PLANNING AND DESIGN OF THE 2026 STREET IMPROVEMENT PROJECT AND ACCEPT THE BOLTON & MENK PROPOSAL FOR DESIGN.
>> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE?
>> ALL OPPOSED, SAME SIGN? MOTION CARRIES.
>> JUST AS A GENERAL UPDATE, FOR ENGINEERING, THE BROWN ROAD PROJECT IS NOW UNDERWAY.
THE CITY WORK IS BEGINNING WITH THE CURB REPLACEMENTS.
WILL TAKE ABOUT THREE WEEKS HOPEFULLY BEFORE WE'RE DONE WEATHER PERMITTING.
THE OTHER THING IS ONE OF OUR DEVELOPMENTS BEGAN WORK THIS WEEK AS WELL.
THE CRYSTAL BAY BUSINESS CENTER ROAD AND UTILITIES PROJECT BEGAN TODAY.
THEY DID HAVE A LITTLE SNAFU, AND THEY CLOSED GOLDENROD WAY THIS MORNING BEFORE THEY SHOULD HAVE, BUT THAT WILL BE CLOSED TOMORROW FOR ABOUT A DAY WHILE WE DO A WATER CONNECTION IN THAT AREA.
THEN THIS WEEK, WE WILL BE OPENING BIDS ON THIS YEAR SANITARY SEWER IMPROVEMENT PROJECT.
HOPEFULLY WE GET SOME GOOD BIDS ON THAT.
THEN WE'LL BE BACK FOR AN AWARD WITH THAT ONE.
>> COULD I ASK YOU? COULD YOU SEND US A SCHEDULE OF THE COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT ARE SUPPOSED TO GO TO THE OTHER THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND THE PARKS COMMISSION?
>> WELL, MAYOR COUNCIL REPORT.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY COMMITTEE REPORTS TO PROVIDE? OTHERWISE, WE WILL ASK FOR COMMENTS,
[Mayor/Council Reports]
IF ANY, FROM OUR COUNCIL.>> I'LL JUST SHARE A LITTLE BIT OF INFORMATION BECAUSE I'VE BEEN SHARING STATISTICS FOR SOME TIME ON ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT RESPONSE AND WHATNOT.
I JUST WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT WHAT LOOKS TO BE JUST A REALLY POSITIVE STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION WITH OFD AND LFT WORKING TOGETHER.
IN THE FIRST 16 WEEKS OF THE YEAR, THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT RESPONDED TO 47 TOTAL CALLS.
IN THE LAST FOUR WEEKS, THEY'VE RESPONDED TO 46.
IT'S NICE TO SEE THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S CONSTANTLY BEEN MESSAGED FROM THE ORONO FIRE DEPARTMENT WAS, WE JUST WANT TO SERVE THE COMMUNITIES.
THIS IS THE FUN PART, AND IT'S SUPER NICE TO BE ABLE TO SEE YOU GUYS AND GIRLS BE ABLE TO DO THAT. THAT'S ALL I WANT TO MENTION.
>> I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING. THANKS.
>> I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING ETHER.
>> I'VE GOT A LOT, BUT I THINK I WOULD JUST MENTION THAT SINCE THE LAST MEETING, I ATTENDED THE NORTHWEST HENNEPIN MAYOR'S MONTHLY MEETING, AND WE HAD A NICE PRESENTATION FROM AHLERS ABOUT TAX INCREMENT FINANCING.
[02:50:02]
NOT A TOOL THAT WE USE A LOT OUT HERE, BUT IT WAS INTERESTING TO LEARN ABOUT IT, AND A LOT OF GOOD QUESTIONS, AND IT'S JUST A GREAT GROUP TO BE A PART OF.I KNOW YOU CAME TO ONE OF THE MEETINGS IN MY ABSENCE.
>> THAT IS A NICE GROUP OF PEOPLE.
>> WITH THAT, I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
>> I MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
>> ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE?
>> ALL OPPOSED, SAME SIGN? MOTION CARRIES. WE ARE ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.